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As everyone (except the newest subscribers to INSOFT-L) knows, Ken Lunde
recently distributed a proposed table of contents for his
soon-to-be-published book _Understanding Japanese Information Processing_
on INSOFT-L.  Chiaki Ishikawa then sent several suggested enhancements
for this book.  Now, Ken has responded with the following reply to
Chiaki's suggestions.  (If you haven't followed this thread previously,
Chiaki's enhancements, incorporated into the original table of contents,
appear at the end of this message).


Jeff
INSOFT-L List Manager

*========================================================================*
 Jeff Bowyer                         EMail:
 Computing Center		     jbowyer@cis.vutbr.cz
 Technical University of Brno
 Udolni 19, 602 00 BRNO
 Czech Republic
*========================================================================*



== Ken Lunde's Reply =================================================

	Thanks for forwarding me the comments. I will take some time to
reply to them now.
	I include Asian character sets and encodings in Chapters 3 & 4
for the sake of comparison. It lets the readers know that Japan is not
alone in how it encodes its characters, and that other Asian countries
have a similar number of characters for use on computers.
	Th Sun keyboard must be a QWERTY keyboard. I am not interested
in keys outside the standard Roman characters, such as function keys.
	The TRON keyboard, as far as I recall, is actually NEC's M-style
keyboard array (this *is* covered in great detail).
	Tcode is covered in Input by Association. Tcode is actually input
by *unassociation*, and is mentioned as such in that section.
	Creating your own fonts can also mean making a limited set of
external characters (yes, I mean gaiji) that can be added to a font.
Adobe Type Composer, which is just being release, and is described in
Chapter 6, lets you do this to a PS font.
	Chapter 8 is not designed to provide a complete listing of
available software -- I just give a few descriptions to let readers
know what sort of software is out there, and what features to expect.
Sun's JLE is mentioned in that section, but not described.
	Also, the section on OSs in Chapter 8 is designed more to show
how to *Japanize* non-Japanese hardware. I mention Japanese PCs in
that section, but describe that they are already Japanized in hardware
(and software).
	I also mention that machine translation software today is more
like machine-aided -- there is always pre- and post-editing required.
The systems that I mention are priced reasonably. There are other
systems that run on platforms such as UNIX, but they are incredibly
expensive.
	I hope this answers your concerns. Feel free to post this to
INSOFT-L as a reply to your comments.

-- Ken Lunde
   lunde@adobe.com



== Chiaki Ishikawa's Suggestions =====================================

Sender: pmcgw!personal-media.co.jp!ishikawa@uunet.UU.NET (Chiaki Ishikawa)
Subject: TOC for Understanding Japanese Information Processing

I don't know much about what this JAPAN.INF is. So I may miss the
whole point, but I took a short look and am impressed with the
throughfullness and the wide coverage of topics.
Such a book? is a great introduction to anyone who is interested in
writing software for the Japanese market.

However, if the authors of this info (a book to be published?) has more
time, I would suggest a few things be incoporated into the content.

Here is what I would add to the content in diff form.

*** japan.inf.toc.original	Tue Jun 22 20:33:38 1993
--- japan.inf.toc	Tue Jun 22 21:10:15 1993
***************
*** 49,54 ****
--- 49,58 ----
  		The Structure of Kanji
  		The History of Kanji
  3: Japanese Character Set Standards
+ 	* Considering that Asian Character Set Standards and
+ Ineternational Character SEt STandards are mentioned in this chapter,
+ either the title of this chapter or the structure of the chapter might
+ need a rearranging. *
  	Non-electronic Character Set Standards
  	Electronic Character Set Standards
  		National Character Set Standards
***************
*** 68,73 ****
--- 72,78 ----
  	Non-electronic Versus Electronic Character Set Standards
  	Advice to Developers
  4: Japanese Encoding Methods
+ 	* Ditto.*
  	National Encoding Methods
  		ASCII/JIS-Roman Encoding
  		EBCDIC/EBCDIK Encoding
***************
*** 102,107 ****
--- 107,113 ----
  		Input by Multiple Criteria
  		Input by Encoded Value
  		Input by Postal Code
+ 	      * Input by Tcode. Tcode input software is mentioned elsewhere.*
  		Input by Association
  		In-line Conversion
  	Japanese Input Hardware
***************
*** 114,119 ****
--- 120,127 ----
  			New-JIS Array
  			Thumb-shift Array
  			50 Sounds Array
+ 	              * Typical or Popular keyboard such as Sun *
+ 	     	      * TRON Keyboard *
  		Roman Character Keyboard Arrays
  			M-style Array
  			High-speed Roman Array
***************
*** 129,135 ****
  		Outline Fonts
  		PostScript Fonts
  		TrueType Fonts
! 		Creating Your Own Fonts
  	Printer Output
  		PostScript Japanese Printers
  		Adobe Type Manager (ATM)
--- 137,143 ----
  		Outline Fonts
  		PostScript Fonts
  		TrueType Fonts
! 		Creating Your Own Fonts * Are you serious ? For all the chars? *
  	Printer Output
  		PostScript Japanese Printers
  		Adobe Type Manager (ATM)
***************
*** 138,143 ****
--- 146,152 ----
  	Computer Monitor Output
  	Vertically Set Japanese Text
  	External Character Handling
+ 		* I take this to mean `gaiji'. Is this correct ? *
  	Special Japanese Text Formatting Functions
  		Japanese Hyphenation
  		Japanese Justification
***************
*** 181,190 ****
--- 190,208 ----
  		Examining Japanese Text Files
  8: Japanese Text Processing Tools
  	Operating Systems and Operating System Extensions
+ 	      * I know that the proposed book? is meant for
+ 	        non-Japanese market, but it would be a disservice to
+ 		omit the mention of Japanese manufacturer's PCs. Among
+ 		others, NEC-PC and its DOS ought to be mentioned.
+ 		After all, this is THE PC in Japan. How it is
+ 		different from IBM PC is a good introduction to
+ 		Japanese PC market of today. *
  		IBM DOS J/V (IBM PC and Compatibles)
  		Microsoft Windows-J (IBM DOS J/V)
  		KanjiTalk and WorldScript II (Macintosh)
  		GomTalk7 (Macintosh)
+ 	      * SUN's JLE. No one can deny that Sun is more popular than
+ 	                  AIX or Irix in the Japanese market.  *
  		AIX (RISC System/6000)
  		Irix (SGI workstations)
  		PenPoint
***************
*** 214,224 ****
  		NJStar (MS-DOS)
  		Nisus & Solo Writer (KanjiTalk)
  		FrameMaker-J (UNIX)
! 		Dedicated Japanese Word Processors
  	Page Layout Software
  		Aldus PageMaker-J (Microsoft Windows-J or KanjiTalk)
  		Adobe Illustrator-J (KanjiTalk)
  		FrameMaker-J (UNIX)
  	On-line Dictionaries
  		JDIC (MS-DOS or IBM DOS J/V)
  		MacJDic (KanjiTalk)
--- 232,250 ----
  		NJStar (MS-DOS)
  		Nisus & Solo Writer (KanjiTalk)
  		FrameMaker-J (UNIX)
! 		Dedicated Japanese Word Processors * Like Ichitaro?
! 		that runs on DOS or are yolu talking about dedicated
! 		Word processor hardware?*
  	Page Layout Software
  		Aldus PageMaker-J (Microsoft Windows-J or KanjiTalk)
  		Adobe Illustrator-J (KanjiTalk)
  		FrameMaker-J (UNIX)
+ 	      * I now understand that this book is not intended to
+ cover non-commercial software, but Japanized version of TeX is pretty
+ popular among computer journals, and I heard that there was a project
+ for typesetting Japanese translation of Britannica using a
+ vertical-version of Japanized Tex! So why don't you at least
+ incorporate either NTT's version  or ASCII's verison of TeX here ? *
  	On-line Dictionaries
  		JDIC (MS-DOS or IBM DOS J/V)
  		MacJDic (KanjiTalk)
***************
*** 227,236 ****
--- 253,298 ----
  		XJDIC (UNIX)
  		Quick Viewer (IBM DOS J/V or KanjiTalk)
  		Translator's Apprentice (NeXTSTEP)
+ 	       * There seem to be a few new recent additions. I don't
+ 	         have much experience though. *
  	Machine Translation Software
  		PC-Transer (IBM DOS J/V)
  		EZ JapaneseWriter (MS-DOS or IBM DOS J/V)
  		TheTranslator (KanjiTalk)
+ 	      * The above except for PC-Transer (or was it Transor (sp)?)
+ 	        may be a joke. I mean there are full-fledged powerful
+ 	        translation systems available that run on EWS.
+ 		Case in point: Sharp DUET that runs on Sharp's UNIX
+ 		boxes. This particular product has probably the
+ 		largest customer base that consist of very serious users
+ 		such as divisions of DEC, Motorola, Olivetti, etc.
+ 		HP's EWS UNIX manuals have been translated by DUET and then
+ 		finished up by a editing agency.
+ 		PC-Transor's progenitor ran on Sun and other
+ 		workstations, but frankly I would vouch for Sharp's
+ 		commitment to user support and frequent bug fixes and
+ 		upgrades. Sharp's product has been in the market a lot
+ 		longer, and the serious users of DUET (including
+ 		myself) has given them many bug reports/sugestions, etc. which
+ 		Sharp promised to fix/incorporate in the product and
+ 		DUET is a very good system now.
+
+ 		Today's machine translation systems are only a support
+ 		tool that help human trnaslator's jobs. In this sense,
+ 		the user support is indispensable. The large user
+ 		group of Sharp's DUET and Sharp's commitment to
+ 		supporting its users is a big plus for this system.
+ 		Other companies such as Hitachi, Oki, Fujitsu and
+ 		others have some type of translation system going, but
+ 		the prototype systems or products don't match Sharp's
+ 		system's capability and Sharp's commitment to its product.
+ 		Many companies declined to respond to a request from a
+ 		translator's journal when the magazine featured a
+ 		special article comparing translation systems. Only a
+ 		few companies including Sharp were comfortable enough
+ 		with their products to answer the questions from the journal.
+ 		So I suggest you put in a section on Sharp DUET.
+ 		Be warned that Machine Translation (MT) is not a panacea. *
  	Terminal Software
  		YKH (MS-DOS or IBM DOS J/V)
  		KCom2 (MS-DOS or IBM DOS J/V)
***************
*** 238,243 ****
--- 300,308 ----
  		NinjaTerm (KanjiTalk)
  		Terminal-J (KanjiTalk)
  		kterm (UNIX)
+ 		* Why not include
+ 			- Japanized version of Kermit, and
+ 			- wterm popluar on DOS?
  9: Using Japanese E-mail and News
  	Sending Japanese E-mail
  	Posting Japanese News
***************
*** 260,265 ****
--- 325,331 ----
  		The JP Domain
  		Bitnet Sites in Japan
  	Getting Connected
+ * I would say the appendix will be very very useful! *
  A: Japanese Code Conversion Table
  B: JIS X 0208-1990 Table
  C: JIS X 0212-1990 Table

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    Chiaki Ishikawa                       Phone:+81-3-5702-0351
  Personal Media Corp.                      FAX:+81-3-5702-0359
 MY Bldg, 1-7-7 Hiratsuka,   UUNET: ... uunet!pmcgw!ishikawa, or
 Shinagawa-ku, Tokyo 142                ishikawa%pmcgw@uunet.uu.net, or
        JAPAN               (in Japan)  ishikawa@personal-media.co.jp
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