🚀 go-pugleaf

Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
> smr <me@shawnritchie.com> wrote:
>>Adam H. Kerman wrote:
> 
>>>At one office, they'd set up Outlook Express years ago. What a horrid client.
> 
>>>They've got an AT&T Web hosting account, through which they also get email.
>>>After the help desk previously denied that they had an IMAP server, one of
>>>the help desk droids admitted that they did indeed have an IMAP server.
> 
>>>So I switched Outlook Express from POP3 to IMAP. I don't know if it's IMAP4,
>>>because it doesn't say. It's helpful to be able to check messages remotely,
>>>which I cannot do with POP3.
> 
>>>How do I adjust the folder order as it appears on the left side
>>>of the screen?  Even though I deleted or moved the messages in the
>>>local Inbox set up for POP3, I cannot delete these mailboxes. It's a
>>>feature. Meanwhile, the IMAP inboxes, the ones I need to check regularly,
>>>appear at the end of the list.
> 
>>>The synchronization feature is likely to cause problems, so I turned it off.
> 
>>>How do I move the IMAP inboxes to the top of the folder list in the
>>>left pane?
> 
>>>It's pretty obvious that Outlook Express assumed most users would use POP3
>>>so they put little thought into making it easy to use IMAP.
> 
>>Honestly, Adam, upgrade to a better client. Express is EOL'd, full of 
>>security issues, and barely understands IMAP at all.
> 
> I've used Windows Live Mail. It has nearly no configurable features! It's
> unforgivable that early versions were unable to quote in a conventional
> manner in reply by default.
> 
>>As for what you want to do: you can't.
> 
> What I want is for "programmers" of Windows mailers to be unable to
> reproduce so these applications go away. They all suck. But how do I
> teach a bunch of volunteers, all older than me, how to use Mail appropriately
> from the Unix shell?

just give them thunderbird, configured correctly and they'll be ok.

> I've used pine, and now alpine, for years. It sucks, too, but the one
> thing it gets perfect is IMAP4 as both are from the same group of programmers.

barely. mark crispin is as stupid as the typical programmer. 

> This is what I want:
> 
> 1) Never encode text messages. quoted-printable must die. It's so stupid
> to encode by default given how readily 8-bit gateways are established.
> 
> 2) Stop inserting pointless non-ASCII characters like single and double
> quotes, hyphens, and spaces. In quotes, make it easy to substitute the
> proper ASCII character for the non-ASCII character.
> 
> 3) If the message contains no UTF8 characters, don't mark it UTF8 for
> some bullshit trying to prove that "my character set is bigger than
> yours!" If there are no 16-bit characters, then mark it with the
> appropriate 8-bit character set like ISO-8859-1 or -15 (which includes
> the Euro currency symbol). If there are only 7-bit characters, then
> mark it ASCII.
> 
> 4) No goddam alternative part attachments by default. Don't even make
> that a feature that can be activated.
> 
> 5) There isn't a single client I've ever found that can get format=flowed
> to work correctly with quoted text. So don't turn that feature on
> by default.
> 
> 6) Stop delimiting URLs with parentheses and underscores. Gah! Who the
> fuck writes this shit? The delimiter, if there must be a delimiter,
> is a pair of angle brackets.
> 
> 7) There isn't a single client that has figured out that quoted
> URLs broken across line boundaries aren't parseable. If you quote a
> broken URL, it must be re-assembled before quoting.
> 
> 8) Stop breaking long URLs period when the user is in the composer.
> Just send it as a long line.

Lots of this whining makes it sound like you just less your mail off the 
spool or cat the files into some dot matrix printer and then get upset 
when all your paper get wasted.

I do agree that email should just be plain ASCII. Fuck anbody else that 
doesn't know English, and I'm serious too. If you don't speak a real 
language, you aren't ready for computers yet.