Thread View: comp.sys.next.misc
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Started by Nicholas C. Weaver (The Weeniehe...
Sat, 12 Dec 1992 02:02
Re: 100 Mips Intel NeXT.
Author: Nicholas C. Weaver (The Weeniehe...
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 02:02
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 02:02
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Why do people make the assumption that NeXT will actually put out a box based on the Intel chip? I doubt NeXT would make hardware that is in direct competition with the cut-rate clones. NeXT will always have it's flagship computers, and will probably keep churning out Moto 680x0 based machines in Freemont. The NeXTstep 486 will most likely be sold to those who bought the wrong computer in the first place, or to clone-makers who will package it preinstalled or something like that. There is NO reason for NeXT to produce 80x86 based machines! Sell the OS on them, yes, but build them? Yes, the moto CPUs are more expensive, and yes, they are generally better, but that cost difference is about $100/machine. It does get signifcant with large numbers, but then NeXT hasn't been involved in major price wars. If it was an Intel based computer, it might be a different story. It's hard to get away with niceties like DSP's, super power-supplies, CPU to printer connection etc... on an architecture where price is just about the ONLY thing that the buyer really looks at. A // machine would be a different story. (I could deal with a nice 3+ 486 machine from NeXT), because there isn't the real cuthroatness among the // machines, and they can be really nice. (I'm logging in through Soda, a 20 processor Sequent on the Berkeley Campus. 20 386's make for a really nice multi-user multi-purpose machine). Also, the r4000 is a nice chip, (64 bit processor and everthing, although it's pinouts make it look like a real porcupine), but is SGI letting it out? SGI owns Mips now, and so they effectively controll the supply of the r4000. Is there currently ANY non-sgi machine that uses the r4000? Furthermore, is the Alpha available to other vendors? The same goes for the POWER chip. And, as for SPARC, NeXT would do better with the same tactic as the Intel chips, an OS for those who bought the wrong machine. -Nick. p.s. When I say "wrong machine", I mean that the OS/Architecture combination doesn't really work for the job that they want it to do, but NeXTstep corrects that problem. -- Nicholas C. Weaver nweaver@soda.berkeley.edu It is a tale, told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, .signifying nothing.
Re: 100 Mips Intel NeXT.
Author: Jeff Weinstein
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 02:15
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 02:15
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In article <1gbh7hINNn7v@agate.berkeley.edu>, nweaver@soda.berkeley.edu (Nicholas C. Weaver (The Weeniehead)) writes: > Also, the r4000 is a nice chip, (64 bit processor and everthing, > although it's pinouts make it look like a real porcupine), but is SGI > letting it out? SGI owns Mips now, and so they effectively controll the > supply of the r4000. Is there currently ANY non-sgi machine that uses the > r4000? This is absolutely untrue. R4000's are neither made by or sold by mips/sgi. They are manufactured by several semiconductor partners in Japan, US and Europe. You can buy them directly from any of the manufacturers. --Jeff -- Jeff Weinstein - X Protocol Police MicroUnity Systems Engineering, Inc. jsw@microunity.com Any opinions expressed above are mine.
Re: 100 Mips Intel NeXT.
Author: Yamanari
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 02:35
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 02:35
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In article <1gbh7hINNn7v@agate.berkeley.edu> nweaver@soda.berkeley.edu (Nicholas C. Weaver (The Weeniehead)) writes: > > Why do people make the assumption that NeXT will actually put out a >box based on the Intel chip? I doubt NeXT would make hardware that is in Because it would be the absolute stupidest thing NeXT could *possibly* do. While this logic might escape some, real NeXT users know that this is all a part of NeXT's secret plan to become the great domineering force of computing. Why, what else but devious planning could account for actually *raising* prices on machines that had been out (but not upgraded) for a year.. HMMMMMmmm. >machines in Freemont. The NeXTstep 486 will most likely be sold to those >who bought the wrong computer in the first place, or to clone-makers who Or to people bright enough to read the writing on Motorola's wall who decided to get a little something for their money. > Also, the r4000 is a nice chip, (64 bit processor and everthing, >although it's pinouts make it look like a real porcupine), but is SGI >letting it out? SGI owns Mips now, and so they effectively controll the I believe the R4000 is/is going to be available from at least three or four different vendors. I've never understood the arguments against the R4000. > Furthermore, is the Alpha available to other vendors? The same goes Anyone know--I'm curious about this one^ >for the POWER chip. And, as for SPARC, NeXT would do better with the same ^ and this one. I didn't hear people making the same comments about the (obscenely late) 88110 (being single-vendor), so I can only assume it's SGIophobia. -- Snout: O Bottom, thou art chang'd! What do I see on thee? Bottom: What do you see? You see an ass-head of your own, do you? ---"I despise mystics, they fancy themselves so deep, when they---- ----aren't even superficial" --Nietzsche ---------------------
Re: 100 Mips Intel NeXT. (R4400 and R4000)
Author: ns111310
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 16:52
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 16:52
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In article <1gbh7hINNn7v@agate.berkeley.edu> nweaver@soda.berkeley.edu (Nicholas C. Weaver (The Weeniehead)) writes: > Also, the r4000 is a nice chip, (64 bit processor and everthing, > although it's pinouts make it look like a real porcupine), but is SGI > letting it out? SGI owns Mips now, and so they effectively controll the > supply of the r4000. Is there currently ANY non-sgi machine that uses > the r4000? > Nicholas C. Weaver > nweaver@soda.berkeley.edu > It is a tale, told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, .signifying > nothing. All this talk about the R4000.... what about the R4400?? I heard on another newsgroup (I know not where) that the R4400 was plug-compatible with the R4000 and offered a significant performance boost (at what cost, I don't know).. but it's at least something to drool about for awhile here in never-never land! my $0.02 -nate sammons ns111310@longs.lance.colostate.edu
Re: 100 Mips Intel NeXT.
Author: Yan Fang/Humanities
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 03:22
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 03:22
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In article <1992Dec12.023530.11426@wam.umd.edu> rsrodger@wam.umd.edu (Yamanari) writes: >In article <1gbh7hINNn7v@agate.berkeley.edu> nweaver@soda.berkeley.edu (Nicholas C. Weaver (The Weeniehead)) writes: >> >> Why do people make the assumption that NeXT will actually put out a >>box based on the Intel chip? I doubt NeXT would make hardware that is in > > Because it would be the absolute stupidest thing NeXT > could *possibly* do. While this logic might escape some, > real NeXT users know that this is all a part of NeXT's > secret plan to become the great domineering force of > computing. Why, what else but devious planning could > account for actually *raising* prices on machines that had been > out (but not upgraded) for a year.. HMMMMMmmm. People aren't assuming that NeXT will put out an Intel box, they're making educated guesses. NeXT is actively asking potential customers if they want an Intel-based NeXT box. I don't know the answers they are getting, but NeXT is asking the question. I haven't known NeXT to let the cat out of the bag before they've put a cat in the bag. As far as why they would port NeXTSTEP to Pentium rather than to sexy 64-bit CPUs: Pentium is the upgrade path of tens of millions of machines in the horizontal market as well as in vertical markets. Pentium makes perfect sense for a firm who wants to sell the DOS of the 1990s--MIPS, Alpha, Precision don't. -- Yan Fang-Magnusson Ph.D. candidate, philosophy, University of Utah yf5990@u.cc.utah.edu yanfang@cc.utah.edu (NeXTmail)
Re: 100 Mips Intel NeXT.
Author: Yamanari
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 05:26
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1992 05:26
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In article <1992Dec13.032244.6133@fcom.cc.utah.edu> yf5990@u.cc.utah.edu (Yan Fang/Humanities) writes: >As far as why they would port NeXTSTEP to Pentium rather than to sexy ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^ And that was *exactly* the right thing for them to do. But releasing software for a hardware platform is not necessarily tied to NeXT releasing the hardware platform themselves. Point: There is no way that NeXT can compete in the Intel based PC market. I would be surprised if they could offer prices competitive with the systems IBM and compaq are shipping these days, let alone the Death Clones (tm) coming in from everywhere. -- Snout: O Bottom, thou art chang'd! What do I see on thee? Bottom: What do you see? You see an ass-head of your own, do you? ---"I despise mystics, they fancy themselves so deep, when they---- ----aren't even superficial" --Nietzsche ---------------------
Re: 100 Mips Intel NeXT.
Author: Arnie Weinstein
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 22:29
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 22:29
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I woul be glad to upgrade my SUN IPC with the NeXT STEP operating system. It has all the basic equipment need to be a NeXT system, However I will need to find a supplier of the proper color Black spray paint. Please Mr Jobs where ever you are just tell me how much it will cost and how many will I need to order to get a SUN IPC to NeXT station software upgrade kit.
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