🚀 go-pugleaf

RetroBBS NetNews Server

Inspired by RockSolid Light RIP Retro Guy

Thread View: comp.unix.sys5.r4
3 messages
3 total messages Started by Evan Leibovitch Mon, 16 Aug 1993 03:56
Univel to be a collector's item, and other stories
#830
Author: Evan Leibovitch
Date: Mon, 16 Aug 1993 03:56
153 lines
8426 bytes
This is part one of a some impressions I received after attending
the Toronto leg of Merisel's Softeach '93 conference, given to the
distributor's dealers and VARs.

Note: what follows below is a blend of facts, hearsay and opinions.
If anyone has any factual corrections, please post them. If anyone has
any corrections to my opinions and impressions, well, I figure you'll
post them too. :-)


**** PART 1 - Univel (for now)

I attended the Novell Unix presentation, given by Chris Johnson.

I guess someone decided that there weren't enough starup glitches for
the fledgling Univel mailing list / newsgroup: now I've got to work on
a namechange for both of them.

It appears the name Univel is going to go away. The USL, Univel, and
NetWare-to-TCP/IP connectivity divisions of Univel are about to combine
in some form. Whether this is a full-blown merger of personnel I'm not
sure, but one of the end results of this appears to be the end of the
company -- and the name -- Univel.

If you think about it, Univel became pretty redundant after Novell
bought USL. Univel is half-owned by Novell, and half-owned by what
is now a division of Novell. Kinda silly, no?

Anyway, it appears that the product(s) currently sold by Univel are
going to become known as UnixWare by Novell. The 1-800-4-UNIVEL number
will be going away too, but there's already a replacement for it, which
is 1-800-772-UNIX.

Also: Those of you who read biz.univel.misc have of late been seeing a
thread regarding why UnixWare's Personal Edition does not come bundled
with TCP/IP (it's presently an optional extra), and whether it should.

This debate can be put to rest. Univel's next release, slated for
September, will be the first in which TCP/IP *will* be bundled in the
PE. I was not told whether it was the Lachman TCP implementation, someone
else's or an in-house version, nor what pricing and upgrade policies
will be.

It's interesting that during questions at the seminar, it was clear that
Novell will not only not discourage, but encourage, the use of TCP/IP
for DOS/Windows-to-Unix networking. Apparently, Novell's LAN Workplace,
the name of its implementation of TCP/IP for DOS/Macintosh, is selling
fantastically, and it's totally possible -- and supported -- to have a
PC/Unix connectivity scenario which uses 100% Novell networking software
but 0% NetWare.

I asked when UnixWare would be including multi-processor support, and
when it would be possible to combine NetWare file server capabilities into
its Application Server. I was told that both are being worked on, but no
specific timeframe yet.

Chris also hinted that there might be a "major" announcement at the Unix
Expo show (New York, late September) regarding "Unix unification", but
would offer no details. I asked whether SCO and/or Solaris might be a part
of this, he said "we hope". Anyone have an idea what this is all about?


**** PART 2 - SCO

Nothing much to say, they had a table staffed by knowledgeable SCO Canada
people, but no any demo units or formal presentations. It was designed
(it seemed) more than anything to explain the company's recent re-structuring
of its product lines.


**** PART 3 - SunSoft

I attended the SunSoft presentation given by Robert Buckley III and
Robert Saft.

Their booth, presentation, and the answers I got to my questions,
really pissed me off.

The two Roberts were very technically on the ball, but most of the
presentation was wasted trying to describe a "man page" to an audience,
of whom more than half didn't know the difference bewteen Unix and OS/2.

As if it's not enough of a headache splintering the Intel Unix market
essentially three ways (Solaris, USL, SCO), SunSoft in its wisdom(sic)
has determined not to stop selling Interactive 3.2, even though Solaris
2.1 for Intel is now shipping. This decision has forced SunSoft to not
only position its Unix products against the competition, but also
against each other.

Despite the presenters' technical skills, neither had any idea of how to
deal with a non-technical audience. In stark contrast to dazzling
graphics all over the conference (including at Solaris' own demo unit),
the presentation was dryly done with the assistance of black and white
overheads that looked like they were done at the last minute.

As for content; I loved what I heard about Wabi (the spelling on SunSoft's
slides were not all-caps), and I hope that USL seriously considers turfing
Merge for the Wabi approach. However, the rest of the presentation, and
the description of Sun's sales and marketing strategies as I heard it,
suck *big time*. If I didn't know any better, I'd swear that all the
people once in charge of marketing Dell Unix went to Solaris. (Hmm, Dell
has chosen to resell Solaris as its Unix-of-the-future. Maybe there's a
connection. Or maybe Dell just has a "reverse Midas touch" when it comes
to Unix -- all the gold it touches turns into crap.)

Based on what I heard in the presentation and answers to my questions
afterwards, I believe Solaris' approach is not only arrogant, but
astoundingly ignorant of the Intel marketplace. Binary in-compatibility
with UnixWare and ODT was *not a concern*, they said. In fact, questions
about comparisons with SCO and UnixWare were brushed aside as if the
products were not even worthy of competition. Well, at a technical level,
they may even be right in some respects. But IMO *nobody* should just
causally brush off the market leaders so casually, especially when
*they're* the newcomer in this field.

The impression I got of their attitude was "hey we're Sun -- they
should be worried about compatibility with *us*, not the other way
around". Yet it appears that the number of Catalyst packages which
has actually been ported to Intel is, shall we say, underwhelming.

When I asked about binary compatibility, they answered with a drawn
out COSE tutorial. A yes or no would have sufficed at the time.

Compared to the tidy approaches of SCO and Novell, Sun's dealer
authorization programs are a joke. You have to buy a $100 dealer sales kit
and a copy of Solaris before you even apply, require some (undefined)
documentation of cerification elsewhere (like a university degree?)
over and above a demonstration of Unix proficiency (either through
courses or tests).

To make matters worse, authorizations to sell Solaris, Interactive, Sun
hardware, and Sun Select (which deals with PC-NFS) are *all* done separately.
Someone correct me, I hope what I was told is wrong, 'cause this is sick.

Marketing wise, SunSoft appears to think that it need do nothing more
than announce its arrival, and everyone will beat a path to it because
they think it's a superior product. Methinks they may be in for a rude
awakeing, and may potentially even suffer the same fate as Dell, for
much the same reasons. Seems like Sun hasn't learned a damn thing since
its last abortive venture into the Intel architecture.

SunSoft needs a clue about selling into the Intel market. And fast.

-- 
 Evan Leibovitch, Sound Software Ltd., located in beautiful Brampton, Ontario
         evan@telly.on.ca / uunet!utzoo!telly!evan / (416) 452-0504
     "It costs a lot of money to look as cheap as I do" -- Dolly Parton


-- 
 Evan Leibovitch, Sound Software Ltd., located in beautiful Brampton, Ontario
         evan@telly.on.ca / uunet!utzoo!telly!evan / (416) 452-0504
     "It costs a lot of money to look as cheap as I do" -- Dolly Parton
Re: Univel to be a collector's item, and other stories
#834
Author: Ron Holt
Date: Tue, 17 Aug 1993 00:37
79 lines
5080 bytes
In article <CBuvEB.Es1@telly.on.ca> evan@telly.on.ca (Evan Leibovitch) writes:
>
>It appears the name Univel is going to go away. The USL, Univel, and
>NetWare-to-TCP/IP connectivity divisions of Univel are about to combine
>in some form. Whether this is a full-blown merger of personnel I'm not
>sure, but one of the end results of this appears to be the end of the
>company -- and the name -- Univel.

They have already combined into the "UNIX Systems Group" (reusing the
name of the old AT&T USG...).  Below is a copy of the press release.

Ron

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Novell Begins Consolidation and Expansion of Unix Business

Announces Creation of UNIX Systems Group
Comprehensive Strategy to Unify UNIX Around Widely Distributed Standard

PROVO, Utah -- July 6, 1993 -- Novell, Inc. (NASDAQ:NOVL) the computer 
networking company, today announced the formation of the UNIX Systems 
Group, a new business unit to leverage and strengthen the company's UNIX 
System activities through a cohesive strategy for ensuring the best 
synergies between Novell's UNIX System and NetWare product lines.  

UNIX Systems Group will be headed by Kanwal S. Rekhi, executive vice 
president and member of the board of directors of Novell.  Rekhi will 
lead the process of building the centralized UNIX business group and 
management team that will drive the UNIX market initiative from Novell.   
 USG becomes the fourth strategic business unit within the company, 
joining the NetWare Systems Group, the Interoperability Systems Group 
and the Desktop Systems Group.

"Customers are asking us to unify UNIX around a single implementation 
that is widely available through distribution channels and from computer 
system vendors around the world," said Raymond J. Noorda chairman and 
chief executive officer of Novell.  "That is our objective.  With 
Novell's acquisition of UNIX System Laboratories completed, the new USG 
business 
unit is intended to smoothly and rapidly pull together our UNIX efforts 
to cooperatively address the present and future needs of computer-users 
and Novell's vendor partners."

Novell's new business unit is being built around the recently acquired 
UNIX System Laboratories and will incorporate established UNIX 
system-related technology, products and programs from within Novell.  In 
addition to USL and the Novell UNIX products, the new unit also includes 
Univel, the joint venture company formed by Novell and USL in December 
1991.  These three complementary business components will be brought 
together under the common umbrella of the new USG.

The management team working with Rekhi in developing the new business 
unit includes Roel Pieper president and chief executive officer of USL 
and Joel Appelbaum president of Univel.

In early 1991, as AT&T brought in outside investors to USL, Novell became 
one of the eleven initial investors and joined the board of directors of 
USL.  The Univel joint venture company was formed between USL and Novell 
in December 1991.  USL became a wholly owned subsidiary of Novell on 
June 14, 1993.  

Novell's business is providing software, systems, service and support for 
computer networks.  NetWare, its primary product, is the services 
platform for managing and controlling the sharing of data across these 
networks.  
UNIX system products that are tightly integrated with NetWare network 
services create ideal platforms for deploying applications across 
computer networks.

Novell, Inc. is the computer networking company, developer of network 
services and specialized and general purpose operating system products, 
including NetWare, UnixWare and Novell DOS.  Novell's NetWare network 
computing products manage and control the sharing of services, data and 
applications among computer workgroups, departmental networks and across 
enterprise-wide information systems.

-- 
Ron Holt   <Ron_Holt@Novell.COM>
Re: Univel to be a collector's item, and other stories
#818
Author: Robert Withrow
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1993 23:02
9 lines
1396 bytes
In article <CBuvEB.Es1@telly.on.ca>, evan@telly.on.ca (Evan Leibovitch) writes:

| SunSoft needs a clue about selling into the Intel market. And fast.

I may not always agree with Evan, but when he's right, he's right!

-- 
 Robert Withrow, Tel: +1 617 598 4480, Fax: +1 617 598 4430, Net: witr@rwwa.COM
 R.W. Withrow Associates, 21 Railroad Ave, Swampscott MA 01907-1821 USA
Thread Navigation

This is a paginated view of messages in the thread with full content displayed inline.

Messages are displayed in chronological order, with the original post highlighted in green.

Use pagination controls to navigate through all messages in large threads.

Back to All Threads