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Jim McCormick <jim@eurog.demon.co.uk> wrote:

> For reasons that need not delay us here I have 2 VDUs a 17 in and 14 in -
> both, as it happens, non-Mac.
> 
> Now the on-line help tells me that I can have both working together and
> refers me to the Manual which refers me to the instruction book that came
> with the VDU!  Not exactly helpful.
> 
> The Mac is a Performa 6200, running 7.5.5 OS with 1MB of Video RAM which I
> understand cannot be increased - but then I may be wrong.
> 
> The questions are:-
> 
> a.    Is it possible to attach the 2 VDUs?

Yes!
> 
> b.    If so how and what would the cost be?
> 
You'll need a video card, for which I would try Mygate computers. You
want an LC slot video card, which may well not be cheap. Obviously, you
may need to buy an adaptor from the video card to the PC connector on
the monitor. I'd suggest hanging the 14 inch off of the built in video,
and the 17 inch off of the video card, as it will probably do higher
resolutions.

-- 
'ric

In article <B113678D96687F90@eurog.demon.co.uk>,
jim@eurog.demon.co.uk (Jim McCormick) wrote:

> For reasons that need not delay us here I have 2 VDUs a 17 in and 14 in -
> both, as it happens, non-Mac.

As others have posted, all you need is a VGA adapter to connect one monitor
to the built in video, and a video card with suitable adapter/cable to
connect the other monitor to .......

BUT, I am not aware of any video cards for the 6200.


PS - Paul Womar states that Macs can run op to 4 monitors. This is
incorrect, Macs can run more if you have the video cards to drive them. In
principal the old NuBus machines could drive 15 monitors with suitable bus
extenders (and a very deep pocket !), though I never got past three myself.

TTFN, Simon

<simon> wrote:

> PS - Paul Womar states that Macs can run op to 4 monitors. This is
> incorrect,

I wonder where I got this from then, maybe it is the number of monitors
that some Windows version was boasting it could/would support.

Jim McCormick <jim@eurog.demon.co.uk> wrote:

[snip]
> a.    Is it possible to attach the 2 VDUs?

I think so.

> b.    If so how and what would the cost be?

As far as I know, what you need to do is get a VGA-to-Mac cable and a
graphics card - run one monitor off the built-in graphics circuitry, and
the other one off the second graphics card, I think.  Cost should be
about �20 (for two cables) plus a graphics card.  This is not
necessarily reliable advice.

Rowland.

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Jim McCormick <jim@eurog.demon.co.uk> wrote:

> For reasons that need not delay us here I have 2 VDUs a 17 in and 14 in -
> both, as it happens, non-Mac.
> 
> Now the on-line help tells me that I can have both working together and
> refers me to the Manual which refers me to the instruction book that came
> with the VDU!  Not exactly helpful.
> 
> The Mac is a Performa 6200, running 7.5.5 OS with 1MB of Video RAM which I
> understand cannot be increased - but then I may be wrong.

It probably can but I hve no real idea, it'd be best to ask a mac
vendor.
 
> The questions are:-
> 
> a.    Is it possible to attach the 2 VDUs?

Yes.

> b.    If so how and what would the cost be?

Well if you don't have one already, you need a special monitor adaptor
which virtually any mac dealer will sell you for about a tenner and then
you will need a graphics card to attatch the other monitor (and possibly
another adaptor, some cards however have PC style ports anyway) you can
then have a workspace that spans both monitors, the mac will support
upto 4 at a time.  Choose whichever video card takes your fancy, I use a
Matrox Millenium which seems a pretty reasonable card to me.

Steve Firth <filter@firthcom.demon.co.uk> wrote:

[snip]

> All Macs support Multiple video displays, but they only have circuitry
> for one display on the motherboard (some don't have any, just like with
> PCs)

I'm going to pick nits and point out that if anyone's ever persuaded a
128K thin Mac (or any of that ilk) to run two displays I'd be *very*
surprised.

[snip]

Rowland.

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Steve Firth <filter@firthcom.demon.co.uk> wrote:

> Rebecca and Rowland <real-address-in-sig@flurbletigibbet.rhubarb.foobar>
> wrote:
> 
> > I'm going to pick nits and point out that if anyone's ever persuaded a
> > 128K thin Mac (or any of that ilk) to run two displays I'd be *very*
> > surprised.
> 
> Maybe not that antique, but it can be done on any Mac with an external
> SCSI interface. 

Really?  Even a Mac Plus? - if so, I'd like to know about it, 'cos I've
got a Mac Plus and a sensibly-sized monitor would be nice).

>I know you like to pop up with these snippets from the
> dawn of computing, but I was there and have moved on,

I'm going to nit-pick again, and point out that the dawn of computing
was something like 2000 years ago, and the dawn of digital electronic
computing was more like 50 or 60 years ago.

> and I'm not going
> to start prefacing every one of my replies with lists of exceptions from
> the Fat Macs backwards.

That would be perfectly sensible if the old Macs were extinct.
Admittedly, 128K and 512K Macs aren't much use, but the 512Ke and Plus
models *are* useful even now (they can run System 6.0.8; a Plus can even
run 7.5.5 if you're deranged).  We've got a Plus in regular use at the
moment, and a 512Ke that I'm going to get LocalTalked as soon as I get
round to it.

Rowland.




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<simon> wrote:
[] 
> PS - Paul Womar states that Macs can run op to 4 monitors. This is
> incorrect, Macs can run more if you have the video cards to drive them. In
> principal the old NuBus machines could drive 15 monitors with suitable bus
> extenders (and a very deep pocket !), though I never got past three myself.

Ah yes - my personal best was 2 portrait A4 monitors, either
side of an A3. :-)

Did I ever mention running a 16" monitor from a Powerbook?
- You logically (and physically) position it above the flipped
right back LCD, and run flight sims, with the instruments on the PB
display and the cockpit view on the big tube... :-)

rgds, Alan

In article <1d4t81k.dmd6wf1iew9xeN@pwomar.demon.co.uk>,
Newsmaster@pwomar.demon.co.uk (Paul Womar) wrote:

> <simon> wrote:
> 
> > PS - Paul Womar states that Macs can run op to 4 monitors. This is
> > incorrect,
> 
> I wonder where I got this from then, maybe it is the number of monitors
> that some Windows version was boasting it could/would support.

It's because a large number of Macs had three slots plus support
for one monitor supplied from the motherboard.

I would like to take this opportunity to scream very loud
                      "VDUs ARE NOT MONITORS !"

VDU are Visual Display Units.  They have screens and keyboards and
communicate with a computer through a serial connection.  They're
used as terminals for minis and mainframes.

Simon.
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Simon Slavin <slavins.at.hearsay.demon.co.uk@localhost> wrote:

[snip]

> I would like to take this opportunity to scream very loud
>                       "VDUs ARE NOT MONITORS !"
> 
> VDU are Visual Display Units.  They have screens and keyboards and
> communicate with a computer through a serial connection.  They're
> used as terminals for minis and mainframes.

Hmmm.....  I always thought that a VDU was part of the terminal, which
included terminal hardware, keyboard, etc.

Rowland.

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Steve Firth <filter@firthcom.demon.co.uk> wrote:

> Rebecca and Rowland <real-address-in-sig@flurbletigibbet.rhubarb.foobar>
> wrote:
> 
> > Really?  Even a Mac Plus? - if so, I'd like to know about it, 'cos I've
> > got a Mac Plus and a sensibly-sized monitor would be nice).
> 
> Yes, but you'd have to keep an eye out for the kit 2nd hand. I doubt if
> anyone makes it now. There were two options, one was a clip that went
> over the Mac Plus CPU and gave you a RAM boost, a 68030 cpu and an A4
> portrait display (greyscale only). The other was the "ScuzzyGraph" a 16
> colour driver that attached to the SCSI port and worked with a standard
> 13" monitor.

Coo - ta!  You learn something new every day.

> > >I know you like to pop up with these snippets from the
> > > dawn of computing, but I was there and have moved on,
> > 
> > I'm going to nit-pick again, and point out that the dawn of computing
> > was something like 2000 years ago, and the dawn of digital electronic
> > computing was more like 50 or 60 years ago.
> 
> No I was there, before 1984 there was little worth looking at.

Hmm - depends on what you wanted to do.  Admittedly, the Mac was a huge
leap in UI design, but it wasn't a huge leap in processing power.

And the other point is that while *you* might have moved on, some of us
still use computers made in 1986.  Yes, serious professional computer
users tend to use more modern kit, but not everyone can afford to do
that.  And personally, I *like* using equipment that's supposedly
`obsolute'.  I've got an oscilloscope that's the same age as me (made in
1967) - and anyone who sneers at a 150MHz dual-beam scope needs his head
examining.

> The Apple
> IIe for sure and a cheap clone of it based on an 8088 chip and made by
> some company in Boca Raton.

If you're considering this sort of thing as worth looking at, you'd also
have to consider things like the Acorn Atom, BBC Micro, etc., and when
did Cray make its first computer?  1970 when?

(btw, how could you make an Apple IIe clone with an 8088?  Surely it
wouldn't be able to run any of the same software, thus being something
other than a clone?)

> > > and I'm not going
> > > to start prefacing every one of my replies with lists of exceptions from
> > > the Fat Macs backwards.
> > 
> > That would be perfectly sensible if the old Macs were extinct.
> 
> Dead and largely buried (mostly in a landfill site by Apple).

Now then - that's a little unfair.  That only happened to the XLs (Lisa
as was).  I seem to get by with my clutch of old Macs - we've got a Plus
in regular use.

Rowland.

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real-address-in-sig@rhu.barb.foobar (Rebecca and Rowland) wrote:

>And the other point is that while *you* might have moved on, some of us
>still use computers made in 1986.  Yes, serious professional computer
>users tend to use more modern kit, but not everyone can afford to do
>that.  And personally, I *like* using equipment that's supposedly
>`obsolute'.

There have been a number of computers I've kept for years after most people
would have considered them obsolete, among them the ...

- Osborne 1
- Tandy 100 and 200
- Original Mac, later upgraded to a Plus

<nostalgia>
The Osborne was a slight pain in having only a 55-character wide screen,
but was otherwise a delightful machine in the pre-portable days. I took it
to the States with me one time and it was an absolutely luxury having
access to my usual machine while I was away.

The Tandy 100 and 200 were beautiful for their intended purpose: text
editing and email access while on the move. Ok, limited screen sizes and
very limited storage capacity, but with a modem you just wrote a document
and then emailed it to yourself for later downloading on your desktop
machine. Battery life of 40 hours (I still miss that!) and, if you do run
out of power, just slap in some more Duracells.

I bought the 7th Mac brought into the UK, upgraded it to a Plus in about
'86 and continued using it until, oh, must have been at least 1990.
Replaced it with one of those super-dooper LC things. :-)
</nostalgia>

Ben

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Steve Firth <filter@firthcom.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> Rebecca and Rowland <real-address-in-sig@flurbletigibbet.rhubarb.foobar>
> wrote:
[]
Steve said:
> > > and I'm not going
> > > to start prefacing every one of my replies with lists of exceptions from
> > > the Fat Macs backwards.
> > 
> > That would be perfectly sensible if the old Macs were extinct.
> 
> Dead and largely buried (mostly in a landfill site by Apple).

FWIW, I *did* once hear a rumour about pallet-loads of excess-inventory
obsolete SEs being crushed at the Apple bonded warehouse in Apeldoorn,
NL, to avoid paying duty if they were taken to a landfill elsewhere....

rgds, Alan

Steve Firth <filter@firthcom.demon.co.uk> wrote:

> Rebecca and Rowland <real-address-in-sig@rhu.barb.foobar> wrote:
> 
> > (btw, how could you make an Apple IIe clone with an 8088?  Surely it
> > wouldn't be able to run any of the same software, thus being something
> > other than a clone?)
> 
> The company making it was one down on HAL.

Ah - pardon me.

Rowland.
(and Arthur Clarke claims that was a co-incidence)

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Ben Lovejoy <ben@lovejoy.demon.co.uk> wrote:

[snip]

> I bought the 7th Mac brought into the UK, upgraded it to a Plus in about
> '86 and continued using it until, oh, must have been at least 1990.

My Mac 512Ke was in use in `a major London teaching hospital' (as they
say) by a prof in 1992 - my dad got it when it was thrown out, and I
know about the dates because he got all the discs too, one of them
containing a 1992 MRC grant application letter.  It came with System 3.2
as well - imagine that, using System 3.2 in 1992...

Rowland.

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In article <1d4xql7.5a4ik61n6e68xN@p21.nas1.is2.u-net.net>,
real-address-in-sig@flurbletigibbet.rhubarb.foobar (Rebecca and wrote:

> Simon Slavin <slavins.at.hearsay.demon.co.uk@localhost> wrote:
> 
> [snip]
> 
> > I would like to take this opportunity to scream very loud
> >                       "VDUs ARE NOT MONITORS !" [snip]
> 
> Hmmm.....  I always thought that a VDU was part of the terminal, which
> included terminal hardware, keyboard, etc.

Nope.  A VDU /is/ a kind of terminal -- the kind with a cathode ray
tube instead of paper.  The keyboard and anything else on that end
of the serial line are part of the VDU.

Trust me: I was using those things almost twenty years ago, before
the Mac had been invented.  Apple ][s were around, though.

Simon.
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Simon Slavin <slavins.at.hearsay.demon.co.uk@localhost> wrote:

> In article <1d4xql7.5a4ik61n6e68xN@p21.nas1.is2.u-net.net>,
> real-address-in-sig@flurbletigibbet.rhubarb.foobar (Rebecca and wrote:
> 
> > Simon Slavin <slavins.at.hearsay.demon.co.uk@localhost> wrote:
> > 
> > [snip]
> > 
> > > I would like to take this opportunity to scream very loud
> > >                       "VDUs ARE NOT MONITORS !" [snip]
> > 
> > Hmmm.....  I always thought that a VDU was part of the terminal, which
> > included terminal hardware, keyboard, etc.
> 
> Nope.  A VDU /is/ a kind of terminal -- the kind with a cathode ray
> tube instead of paper.  The keyboard and anything else on that end
> of the serial line are part of the VDU.

Hmm - I'll take your word for it for now.  I recall reading about what a
VDU was, but none of the books I have here mention VDU in any context
other than the VDU commands available on the BBC Micro, which isn't very
helpful really.

> Trust me: I was using those things almost twenty years ago, before
> the Mac had been invented.  Apple ][s were around, though.

Erm - I was using the things almost 20 years ago too.  It doesn't mean
I've got the terminology straight.

Rowland.

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