🚀 go-pugleaf

In article <haws.766793397@cambridge>, haws@cambridge.mitchell.com (Brent
Haws) wrote:

> 
> 
> HELP!!!

Right.

> If you would like to help please send us the following information on your
> vehicle by June 30 1994.  It is VERY important to make sure that the data is
> as complete and accurate as possible.

Anyone else smell a rat?

Specifically, you can't get a car registered with no VIN. Chop shops would
love to have a list of valid VINs for specific makes and models. Caveat
Scriptor.

Disclaimer: This could be a perfectly legitimate request, by someone who
doesn't know how, or won't take the trouble, to ferret out a systemic way
to get this info. 

Steve

-- 
smiklos@panix.com   noslfcntrl@aol.com   Steve Miklos @ home
"The folly of mistaking a paradox for discovery, a metaphor for a proof, a
torrent of verbiage for a spring of capital truths, and oneself for an
oracle, is inborn in us."  -- Valery

>In article <haws.766793397@cambridge>, haws@cambridge.mitchell.com (Brent
>Haws) wrote:

>> 
>> 
>> HELP!!!


>> If you would like to help please send us the following information on your
>> vehicle by June 30 1994.  It is VERY important to make sure that the data is
>> as complete and accurate as possible.

>Anyone else smell a rat?

I do. If this person needs to get VIN numbers from cars, he can go to his 
friendly neighborhood junkyard. 

Oh, my mistake! These cars would have _salvage_ titles... silly me!

I would think that the best way to get VIN numbers for a legitimate research
project is to contact the manufacturer. That would be a simple way to gather
statistics. 

If this person is legitimately making a VIN decoder, he just needs to know
what each manufacturer's numbers mean. He certainly doesn't need a record
of a number of people's VINs. 

 
-- 
Graham E. Thomas                  *  DISCLAIMER: My words are my own,  
Georgia Institute of Technology   *  not those of my employer.  
Internet: grahamt@oit.gatech.edu  *   

In article <smiklos-190494234934@smiklos.dialup.access.net> smiklos@panix.com (Steve Miklos) writes:

   In article <haws.766793397@cambridge>, haws@cambridge.mitchell.com (Brent
   Haws) wrote:

   > 
   > 
   > HELP!!!

   Right.

   > If you would like to help please send us the following information on your
   > vehicle by June 30 1994.  It is VERY important to make sure that the data is
   > as complete and accurate as possible.

   Anyone else smell a rat?

   Specifically, you can't get a car registered with no VIN. Chop shops would
   love to have a list of valid VINs for specific makes and models. Caveat
   Scriptor.

-----<snip>--------

Hey guy:
	The man has 192 page document from NICB (National Insurance
Crime Bureau) that describes the exact method of decoding the V.I.N.
of
various manufacuturers. Guess What??? No manufacuturer maintains the
same
VIN decoding as any other, further, a manufacturer may not even do
it the same way in successive years, thus the 192 page document.

The guy is writing a VIN decode routine that extracts the maximum
information from the VIN number, including body/engin/drive train
options. Give him a break, please.


--
 johnson@mitchell.com       or  | Opinions? I doan' have no steenkin'
 hugh@seada.com             or  | opinions. They doan' let me have
 76317.2234@compuserve.com      | none.

Before responding consider that you may be putting your auto at risk of
theft.

-- 

- Bill Seurer     Language and Compiler Development      IBM Rochester, MN
  Business: BillSeurer@vnet.ibm.com               Home: BillSeurer@aol.com

In article <smiklos-190494234934@smiklos.dialup.access.net>,
Steve Miklos <smiklos@panix.com> wrote:
>In article <haws.766793397@cambridge>, haws@cambridge.mitchell.com (Brent
>Haws) wrote:
>
>> 
>> 
>> HELP!!!
>
>Right.
>
>> If you would like to help please send us the following information on your
>> vehicle by June 30 1994.  It is VERY important to make sure that the data is
>> as complete and accurate as possible.
>
>Anyone else smell a rat?
>
>Specifically, you can't get a car registered with no VIN. Chop shops would
>love to have a list of valid VINs for specific makes and models. Caveat
>Scriptor.

Anyone who wants VIN numbers can just walk down the street and read them off
of any car of their choice.  They are clearly visible through a cars 
windshield.  Yes, it does require more effort but it is not that difficult
to do.  You can also be sure the information you get is accurate.
>
----------------------
Alex Rodriguez

We can't tell what this fellow is doing, but on the optimistic hand,
just think how useful a VIN decoder could be. 

When you bring your car in to the shop, they could use the VIN to look up
your particular car in a central database shared by all shops.  It could
get your car's history, plus know how to order 3rd party parts for it
without needing any other (possibly wrong) info from a fallible human.
Looking up parts in a cross reference guide is error prone.

In article <smiklos-190494234934@smiklos.dialup.access.net> smiklos@panix.com (Steve Miklos) writes:
>In article <haws.766793397@cambridge>, haws@cambridge.mitchell.com (Brent
>Haws) wrote:
>
>> 
>> 
>> HELP!!!
>
>Right.
>
>> If you would like to help please send us the following information on your
>> vehicle by June 30 1994.  It is VERY important to make sure that the data is
>> as complete and accurate as possible.
>
>Anyone else smell a rat?
>
>Specifically, you can't get a car registered with no VIN. Chop shops would
>love to have a list of valid VINs for specific makes and models. Caveat
>Scriptor.
>
>Disclaimer: This could be a perfectly legitimate request, by someone who
>doesn't know how, or won't take the trouble, to ferret out a systemic way
>to get this info. 
>
If they are legitimate, all they have to do is get an owners manual for a
particular make.  Every car makers VIN is different.  A w on an olds in a
certain place will indicate 6 cyl 2.8 litter engine.  An r in the same
spot will show a 6 cyl with 3.8 displacement ( for the same car).  So your
VIN decoder must first be informed on what carmakers vin it is.  There is
a chance that VIN includes maker and model as part of the number.

____________________________________________________________________________
Arnold
Drexel University
st93he7f@dunx1.ocs.drexel.edu
____________________________________________________________________________

In article <smiklos-190494234934@smiklos.dialup.access.net> smiklos@panix.com (Steve Miklos) writes:
>
>Disclaimer: This could be a perfectly legitimate request, by someone who
>doesn't know how, or won't take the trouble, to ferret out a systemic way
>to get this info. 

it seems to me that the easiest way to get a bunch of VINs quickly
would be to walk out in the parking lot (or on the street) and start
reading them from parked cars.

aftermarket maintenance books often explain the whole VIN coding
system (probably where the data for the programmer in question came
from).

--
#include <std.disclaimer>
tom glaab
tglaab@nooster.navy.mil

In article <2p3jrc$rhq@apakabar.cc.columbia.edu> adr5@konichiwa.cc.columbia.edu (Alex D Rodriguez) writes:

>Anyone who wants VIN numbers can just walk down the street and read them off
>of any car of their choice.  They are clearly visible through a cars 

Yeah, but that doesn't tell you everything you need.  If you're
trying to find how to map, say, the VIN to the year, reading off
a car is no good unless you can tell its year by looking.  I can't.

But I didn't respond because if they're a commercial company, as
they appear to be, and they're planning to write software to
sell, they should be willing to cough up to the manufacturers to
get the needed data, not expect people on the net to do it for
them.  If they're going to give away the software or whatever
they're producing, that would be different.

In article <2p3b9c$vuo@locutus.rchland.ibm.com>, seurer@nordruth.rchland.ibm.com (Bill Seurer) writes:
|> Before responding consider that you may be putting your auto at risk of
|> theft.

I'll assume you meant *increased* risk of theft, since your auto is
already at risk of theft (it's parked, isn't it :-) ) .

How do you arrive at this conclusion?  Don't you realize that anyone
can look through your front windshield and get the VIN?  And how the
heck is this guy going to find your car after you give him the VIN?

|> -- 
|> 
|> - Bill Seurer     Language and Compiler Development      IBM Rochester, MN
                                                            ^^^
Hmmmmm....

|>   Business: BillSeurer@vnet.ibm.com               Home: BillSeurer@aol.com

>VIN            1G1AD69P0DJ200929 
>
>YEAR           1983
>
>MAKE           Chevy
>
>MODEL          Cavalier
>
>BODYSTYLE      4-door
>
>SUB-MODEL      CS
>
>ENGINE         2.0L TBFI
>
>

-- 
Old Programmers Never Die ... They Just Lose Their Bits

In article <2p3b9c$vuo@locutus.rchland.ibm.com> BillSeurer@vnet.ibm.com writes:
>Before responding consider that you may be putting your auto at risk of
>theft.

Another thought on the thread re those who say to just look in
windshields - the other stuff, like engines, etc, is not available with
a glance.

Dunno if there is any ulterior motive, but just looking at cars will
not get it for the stated objectives of the poster...
ZZ
>
>-- 
>
>- Bill Seurer     Language and Compiler Development      IBM Rochester, MN
>  Business: BillSeurer@vnet.ibm.com               Home: BillSeurer@aol.com


-- 
Skip Gundlach, 1439wells and 2539fi for the shy
Multi-faceted and -talented musician and survivor
Please note that the from: line is wrong.  I am skip@gamma.bae.uga.edu,
not skip@gamma.*stat*.uga.edu.  We will get that fixed someday...

In article <2p436k$knl@larry.rice.edu>,
Catherine Anne Foulston <cathyf@is.rice.edu> wrote:
>In article <2p3jrc$rhq@apakabar.cc.columbia.edu> adr5@konichiwa.cc.columbia.edu (Alex D Rodriguez) writes:
>
>>Anyone who wants VIN numbers can just walk down the street and read them off
>>of any car of their choice.  They are clearly visible through a cars 
>
>Yeah, but that doesn't tell you everything you need.  If you're
>trying to find how to map, say, the VIN to the year, reading off
>a car is no good unless you can tell its year by looking.  I can't.

Here in NY the car make and year is on the registration sticker that is 
required by law to be clearly visible on the windshield.



-----------------------
Alex Rodriguez

In article <1994Apr20.203244.19212@mprgate.mpr.ca>, vanderby@mprgate.mpr.ca (David Vanderbyl) writes:
|> In article <2p3b9c$vuo@locutus.rchland.ibm.com>, seurer@nordruth.rchland.ibm.com (Bill Seurer) writes:
|> |> Before responding consider that you may be putting your auto at risk of
|> |> theft.
|> 
|> I'll assume you meant *increased* risk of theft, since your auto is
|> already at risk of theft (it's parked, isn't it :-) ) .
|> 
|> How do you arrive at this conclusion?  Don't you realize that anyone
|> can look through your front windshield and get the VIN?  And how the
|> heck is this guy going to find your car after you give him the VIN?

Let's see.  I am an auto theft and I am looking for, oh, Mercedes (one of
the examples he used).  I post a message here and get a nice long list of
them.  Using the poster's names I look up their addresses and voila!

|> |> -- 
|> |> 
|> |> - Bill Seurer     Language and Compiler Development      IBM Rochester, MN
|>                                                             ^^^
|> Hmmmmm....

?
-- 

- Bill Seurer     Language and Compiler Development      IBM Rochester, MN
  Business: BillSeurer@vnet.ibm.com               Home: BillSeurer@aol.com

In article <2p60ab$1c6k@locutus.rchland.ibm.com>,
Bill Seurer <BillSeurer@vnet.ibm.com> wrote:
>
>Let's see.  I am an auto theft and I am looking for, oh, Mercedes (one of
>the examples he used).  I post a message here and get a nice long list of
>them.  Using the poster's names I look up their addresses and voila!

This information is readily available, for a fee, from your state department
of motor vehicles.  How do you think the local dealership got your name and
address and flooded you with special deals and offers?  You can get the type
of car owned and the address for all cars registered in your state.

--------------------
Alex Rodriguez

Don't waste time making a VIN decoder, the Office of Mobile Sources (OMS)
of the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) has such a program available
for download fron ttnbbs.rtpnc.epa.gov; the program also includes some 
test data.

-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Wael M. El-Sharif                *** Opinions Expressed Are My Own ***
Consulting Engineer -- Marketing of Technology
Internet: waele@seas.gwu.edu / welshari@cap.gwu.edu / el-sharw@iia.org

In article <smiklos-190494234934@smiklos.dialup.access.net> smiklos@panix.com (Steve Miklos) writes:
>In article <haws.766793397@cambridge>, haws@cambridge.mitchell.com (Brent
>Haws) wrote:
>
>> If you would like to help please send us the following information on your
>> vehicle by June 30 1994.  It is VERY important to make sure that the data is
>> as complete and accurate as possible.
>
>Anyone else smell a rat?
>
>Specifically, you can't get a car registered with no VIN. Chop shops would
>love to have a list of valid VINs for specific makes and models. Caveat
>Scriptor.

Wouldn't a check of DMV records show that this vehicle is already registered?

>Disclaimer: This could be a perfectly legitimate request, by someone who
>doesn't know how, or won't take the trouble, to ferret out a systemic way
>to get this info. 
>
>Steve

This information is available in every factory shop manual that I have ever
seen for an automobile.  The fields in the VIN indicate the body style, motor,
etc. that the manufacturer built the car with.  It will also indicate the
plant in which the vehicle was manufactured.  This is pretty common knowledge and
should be available at the public library.  Barring that, check used book stores
for old shop manuals.

BTW -- if you want a copy of the VIN pages from the
'92 Honda Accord manual, let me know.  Maybe I'll even enter the information
and email it to you if you give me a copy of the completed program.

-Jim.
-- 
 James A. Babcock, Software Engineer  Phone:  (703) 793-1020
 Netrix Corporation                   Favorite quote:
 13595 Dulles Technology Drive        "Noone can make you feel inferior without
 Herndon VA  22071                     your cooperation"        -E. Roosevelt

In article <2p68i9$lrg@apakabar.cc.columbia.edu>, adr5@merhaba.cc.columbia.edu (Alex D Rodriguez) writes:
|> In article <2p60ab$1c6k@locutus.rchland.ibm.com>,
|> Bill Seurer <BillSeurer@vnet.ibm.com> wrote:
|> >
|> >Let's see.  I am an auto theft and I am looking for, oh, Mercedes (one of
|> >the examples he used).  I post a message here and get a nice long list of
|> >them.  Using the poster's names I look up their addresses and voila!
|> 
|> This information is readily available, for a fee, from your state department
|> of motor vehicles.  How do you think the local dealership got your name and
|> address and flooded you with special deals and offers?  You can get the type
|> of car owned and the address for all cars registered in your state.

My local dealership doesn't flood me with offers.  The one I bought my
newer car at does and the one where I service my older car does.  Not
too hard to figure out where they got the info is it?

Whether this info is available from the DMV probably varies from state to
state.
-- 

- Bill Seurer     Language and Compiler Development      IBM Rochester, MN
  Business: BillSeurer@vnet.ibm.com               Home: BillSeurer@aol.com

Well, the first letter, I believe, ALWAYS indicates the country of
origin -- like a J for Japan. 

Stephan

Yes, I agree, give him a break!!! Such  a decoder would be perfect
for autoshops, insurance companies etc.

Brent Haws (haws@cambridge.mitchell.com) wrote:


: HELP!!!

: Here at Mitchell we are developing VIN (Vehicle Identification Number)
: decoder and would like some actual VIN's to test with.

: If you would like to help please send us the following information on your
: vehicle by June 30 1994.  It is VERY important to make sure that the data is
: as complete and accurate as possible.

--SNIP--


If this ISN'T a scam, why hasn't the original poster 'Brent Haws' replied

yedBrent Haws?  Isn't that the guy who is collecting Social Security #'s on


alt.privacy??


--
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:
:If this ISN'T a scam, why hasn't the original poster 'Brent Haws' replied
:

for one thing, he couldn't possably be _reading_ all of
the groups he posted to..
-- 
george     --    george@mech.seas.upenn.edu

In article <CoMEBI.GLv@netrix.com> jab@netrix.com (James A Babcock) writes:


   This information is available in every factory shop manual that I have ever
   seen for an automobile.  The fields in the VIN indicate the body style, motor,
   etc. that the manufacturer built the car with.  It will also indicate the
   plant in which the vehicle was manufactured.  This is pretty common knowledge and
   should be available at the public library.  Barring that, check used book stores
   for old shop manuals.

   BTW -- if you want a copy of the VIN pages from the
   '92 Honda Accord manual, let me know.  Maybe I'll even enter the information
   and email it to you if you give me a copy of the completed program.

- - - - - - <snip> - - - - - - - - - 

Lets see.......'92 Honda Accord.....hhmmmmm.............

Yeah, yeah!  Here it is.........

If it is a 2Dr coupe, or 4Dr Sedan or a Wagon, then the first three
of the VIN is 1HG, unless, but, hey! Some 4Dr sedans start with JHM,
Hmmm..... 

Next 3 chars say the engine type, which would be either CB7 or CB9.
The next character is either a 4 or a 5 or a 7, that's the series or
restraint system in the car.

The next character is the Check Digit, followed by the Year Digit,
in this case, it should be 'N'
Now comes the fun part, the next digit indicates the plant location
that the car was built, let's see....it's either a A, or a C, or an
L or an H or possbile the letter S, representing Marysville Ohio,
Saitama Japan, East Liberty Ohio, Alliston Ontario (Canada) or
Suzuka Japan (all in the order, above). Now for the Accord, it could
be A, C or L (no others)

Now what I can not do, is determine the value of the Check Digit,
due to the fact that I do not know which plant the car was made, the
series number (serial number at that plant) the engine type nor the
body type.

But this is just one example............


--
 johnson@mitchell.com       or  | Opinions? I doan' have no steenkin'
 hugh@seada.com             or  | opinions. They doan' let me have
 76317.2234@compuserve.com      | none.

In article <Con3EA.BD1@rci.ripco.com> johnc@rci.ripco.com (John Conroy) writes:

   Brent Haws (haws@cambridge.mitchell.com) wrote:

   : HELP!!!

   : Here at Mitchell we are developing VIN (Vehicle Identification Number)
   : decoder and would like some actual VIN's to test with.

   : If you would like to help please send us the following information on your
   : vehicle by June 30 1994.  It is VERY important to make sure that the data is
   : as complete and accurate as possible.

   --SNIP--


   If this ISN'T a scam, why hasn't the original poster 'Brent Haws' replied

   yedBrent Haws?  Isn't that the guy who is collecting Social Security #'s on


   alt.privacy??

 -- -- < SNIP > -- -- --

HI

No, I am not the guy collection social security numbers.

Have you tried to finger me at this e-mail address? (If you don't
know what I am talking about, get out your UNIX books, boys.)


The VIN request was an honest one.  Thanks to all those who
responded.

I did this same test in house on our email and had a
good response.  Thought that I try it on the big net, looks like it
was a mistake.  Anyways, if anyone would still like to help you only
need to sent the first 10 charaters, (we are not checking the check
digit at this time.)





























--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Brent Haws                 | Tomorrow is yet another day!
 haws@Mitchell.com          |