🚀 go-pugleaf

In article <26138@life.ai.mit.edu> gwydion@hal.gnu.ai.mit.edu (Basalat Ali Raja) writes:
> One cannot help but ask...  Israel is the only democracy in the middle
> east?  How many of the Palestinians whose very lives and destiny are
> directly controlled by the Zionist government in Jerusalem have had a
> chance to vote against or in favour of this government?
>
> Spare me the lawyer's answers, that these people are immigrants, or
> refugees or whatever.  They have been there for generations, in many
> cases much longer than their Jewish neighbours who CAN vote.  And yet
> you claim that Israel is a democracy?  Only if you accept as a
> corollary that the Palestinians are not human.  Will you do that?

Mr. Raja (or is it Mr. Ali Raja?  I prefer to be correct and polite) brings
up two questions that should be addressed, and I will add one or two of my
own...

First is the issue of the vote.  It is easy to see that the situations in
Israel (Jews and Palestinians) bears a striking resemblance to the situation
in South Africa (Whites and Blacks), in terms of a minority dedicated to
retaining control of the nation by means of limitation or elimination of
rights of the majority.  One would think that other nations of the world
would act with equal measures towards Israel as they have towards South
Africa to affect some change - sanctions, embargos, boycotts of products,
and the like.

However, the situations are quite different, and the Israeli position is
much more justified.  The Jewish state was brought into existance in 1948
for a reason - Jews have historically been a persecuted race since the
beginning of recorded history, and only a Jewish native homeland where
Jews would be safe to live in peace and could seek sanctuary when no other
nation would lend assistance.  In fact, the US does not have such a great
record in these matters - it refused assylum to German Jews who sought
to escape the holocaust in Nazi Germany, which is RECENT history!

Equally important is the fact that the UN resolution of 1948 established
a nation/homeland for the Palestinians, as well.  The Palestinians rejected
their own homeland, justified by their own reasoning which I will not
refute in any way.  And in rejecting the UN resolution, the Palestinians
swore to destroy the state of Israel, and even made it part of the charter
or "constitution" of the PLO.  I truly believe that Yassir Arafat was
sincere in his "declaration of independance" speech of a couple years
ago when he claimed that the PLO no longer sought the destruction of
the Jewish state, but I wonder if he truly speaks for the majority
(or should I simply say ALL) of the Palestinians.

So what would it mean if Israel gave the right to vote to the Palestinians?
A mass flood of Palestinians into the state from the surrounding Arab states
to an extent that the Jews would no longer have a majority vote.  The state
of Israel would no longer be the state of Israel but would become a Palestinian
state.  From the Israeli (or Zionist) viewpoint, allowing the Palestinains to
become a part of the Jewish Democracy in Israel is suicide, not only for the
state of Israel but for Jews everywhere in the world.

Second, Mr. Raja asks if Zionists or Americans or posters in this group
accept the Palestinians as human beings.  OF COURSE we do!  That is what
makes the situation a cruel one and an unusual one.  There is no desire
of Zionists in Israel to control mass numbers of militant/unruly/unhappy
Palestinians - but there is an absolute resolve among the Zionists that
Isreal should survive at all costs...  I would ask WHY the state of Isreal
would allow Palestinians every right of citizenship besides the right
to vote (and hence to destroy Isreal as Isreal MUST be)?

So, let me offer what I can, which is my opinions and ideas for solutions
to the Palestinian question.  It is clear that Jews and Arabs can live
together in Peace - I as a Jew count a number of Arabs, both immigrants
and US born, as great friends.  There is a clear and mutual love and trust
among us, in spite of situations elsewhere in the world.  There is no need
for one side to exterminate the other but there is a need to find a way
to live throughout the world in harmony and peace and to encourage eachother's
prosperity and growth.

There really is only one stumbling block to peace and prosperity in Isreal
and a new Palestinian state that Arafat has asked the world to recognize
and support.  Land.  Where is the Palestinian state to be established?

To go back 45 years to the territories specified in the original UN resolution
would make little sense, considering the events of those 45 years.  Does it
make sense to make a Palestinian state that is entirely encompassed by the
state of Israel on all sides?  Does it make sense for Isreal to give up land
that they have developed for decades?  I don't believe so (remember, this
is MY opinion).  As well, the Palestinians do not just pose "problems" for
the state of Israel, but for other Arab states, such as Jordan and Lebanon...

Here is what I would propose, if I were able to, as the leader of Isreal.
I would propose that Isreal, Lebanon, and Jordan all give a portion of their
land to make a new nation for Palestinians to use for the creation of a new
state.  Isreal would give up some land from its northern provinces (Golan
Heights), Lebanon would give up area from its southern borders, and Jordan
would give up area from its western borders.  This would provide a wonderful
place for Palestinians to establish a nation.  There would be access to
the Mediterranian sea, rich and fertile land, and a place where Palestinians
could call their own (again!  after 45 years).

Isreal, Lebanon, and Jordan must each be compensated by the world community
in return for the land they give up.  As an American, I would urge my
country to support the new Palestinian state, whether it was a monarchy or
a true democratic state, with as much aid as we now give to Egypt and
Israel - $2Bil per year.  The hope being that the Palestinians could
grow their nation as a peaceful and harmonious one among the nations of
the world.  As well, those nations who give up land should be compensated
once for the value of the land - if Isreal gave up a developed City while
the other nations gave up acres of desert, Israel should be compensated
in a manner that allows them to (start to) build a new city within its
borders.  This same reasoning should be applied equally.

There is also the issue of Jerusalem, which has religious significance
to ALL religions of the world - Islaam, Judaism, and Christianity.  Some
have argued that the city should become an international city under no
state's domain.  Whether or not such a proposal is tenable is doubtful
to me, since one must still travel through the borders of Jordan or
Isreal to reach it.  But if, at least, the state of Israel guaranteed
free access to the city for religious purposes (do they not now?) for
eternity, is it really an issue?

Lastly, I must point out that the issues involved in the Middle East
are ones that few outside the region can truly understand.  We in the
US are motivated by our own definition of freedom, free markets,
trade laws, etc.  Jews as a race have a radically different motivation,
and Palestinians have a different (yet equally radical) set of motivations.
As long as the motivations are oriented towards peace and harmony with
others and are not oriented towards the suppression or extermination
of the others, a lasting Peace can be had.

Now, if only it were as easy as I suggest ... :)

Have a great day, folks.

--
Amiga programmer of: GRn, MailMinder, Budokan, Beyond Dark Castle, Dark Castle
Sega Genesis programmer of: Dick Tracy and Marble Madness.
Mike Schwartz  (ames!zorch!amiga0!mykes or mykes@amiga0.sf-bay.org)
1124 Fremont Ave.
Los Altos, CA 94024