🚀 go-pugleaf

In article <39068F10.76220F54@dmi.szote.u-szeged.hu>,
Varga Gyorgy  <varga@dmi.szote.u-szeged.hu> wrote:
>Yahya M wrote:
>
>> Proto-Finno-Ugrian *kapp3- 'to take, to seize, to grasp': Finnish kaappaus
>> 'capture, coup, hijacking'; Mordvin kapode- 'to grab quickly'.
>> Proto-Finno-Ugrian *k�pp� 'hand, paw': Finnish k�pp� 'hand, paw', 
>> Estonian k�pp  'claw, paw, hand'.
>
>Yep, and Hungarian kap /kOp/ 'to receive, to get'.
>Varga Gy�rgy

Not so, since if the Hungarian word were derived from a putative FU 
'*kapp3-' (a root which I haven't seen reconstructed in the FU literature --
where did you get it from, Yahya M?) it would certainly be 'hap' and not
'kap'!  

I feel that a connection of the Hungarian word to the Turkish kap- (qap-)
can hardly be ruled out and it's not clear to me why TESz (the Hungarian
historical/etymological dictionary) rejects that ex cathedra, pronouncing
the word "probably of onomatopeic origin', but TESz is certainly right in 
ruling out an FU derivation, for the above reason.  There are *no* words with
initial k- and back vocalism in the FU-derived Hungarian word stock.  
Absolutely regular sound change, k->h/$_V[+back].

If you believe the Nostratic stuff then H. 'kap' could still belong in this
family if you thought it to be a borrowing from Turkic qap-.  In any case
a healthy skepticism, and an protective tendency against overly-loose
identifications, is always in order when dealing with such long-range 
comparisons.  

By the way, I'm not aware of any Finnish word k�pp� meaning 'hand, paw',
though I imagine it could be present in some dialect, presumably the same
word as the Estonian k�pp YM cited.  FU *k�pp� isn't, so far as I know, a
well-accepted etymology for this word.  It's been posited as the root of
Est. k��bas 'barrow, burial mound, tumulus' and F. dial. k�pp� 'hill'
but that is a semantic domain that is very distant from hand/paw/grab 
(I mean of course engl. 'grab' not d. 'Grab'!) etc.

Adam Jacobs
UCLA