🚀 go-pugleaf

rbwinn wrote:
> On Aug 1, 11:54�pm, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>> rbwinn wrote:
>>> On Aug 1, 8:25 am, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>> On Jul 31, 6:11 pm, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>> On Jul 31, 5:45 am, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Jul 30, 10:15 pm, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 30, 6:13 pm, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 30, 5:37 pm, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 30, 3:13 am, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 22, 5:24 am, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 21, 8:39 pm, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 21, 7:16 pm, "Dogmantic Pyrrhonist (AKA Al)"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <alwh...@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 21, 5:51 pm, rbwinn <rbwi...@juno.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 20, 7:54 pm, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 20, 2:53 pm, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 20, 10:00 am, DanielSan <daniel...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 20, 6:34 am, Stan-O <bndsna...@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 19 Jul 2008 22:27:44 -0700 (PDT), rbwinn <rbwi...@juno.com>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> No, a couple of atheists have told me that. ?They said he was a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Russian Orthodox and an alcoholic.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He was an alcoholic.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So, you're making things up again.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hint: He was not a Christian merely because an atheist claimed he was...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hint #2: ?What school did Stalin go to in 1888?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Stalin went to a Russian Orthodox seminary. ?He rejected what he was
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> taught there and became a mass murderer.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Only partially true. Like I told you before, politicians, and in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> particular tyrants, will say anything to gain or remain in power.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, Stalin did say he was an atheist. ?He told the truth about that.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He never openly admitted this. In fact, his religious beliefs were
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> pretty vague. What he hated was the concept of god as presented by the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ROC. He did, however, find a political use for the church when it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> suited his purpose.- Hide quoted text -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Show quoted text -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That is quite a statement. So you are saying that Stalin did not
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> believe in the Communist Manifesto?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tyrants will use or believe anything to maintain their control. He
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> probably found some parts useful, and ignored anything that
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contradicted his personally ideologies...pretty much the same with you
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and your bible...- Hide quoted text -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Stalin tried to stamp out religion in the Soviet Union. It is well
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> documented.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And what's that got to do with atheism?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Stalin was a prominent atheist of his time who is claimed to have been
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a Christian by atheists of today.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Don't change the subject. What has what Stalin tried to do relevant to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> atheism?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So what is the matter? Stalin and Pol Pot were atheists. They will
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> never turn into Christians no matter how many times you try to claim
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they were.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Don't you atheists ever take responsibility for anything?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Because what they did is irrelevant to me? Now, back onto the question
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you are REFUSING to answer:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> What has what Stalin tried to do ("tried to stamp out religion in the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Soviet Union") relevant to atheism?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Stalin was an atheist. His values and beliefs were much like yours
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are today.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Robert B. Winn
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Torquemada was a christian. His values and beliefs were much like
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> yours are today. And you're doing your best to make us all see the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> point of shooting christians. You really are.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Al- Hide quoted text -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, let's talk about those feelings, Al. Pol Pot was just an
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> unassuming atheistic school teacher until he became a Communist
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dictator.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So, really, aren't you talking about communism and totalitarianism?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> What does atheism have to do with it?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Under World Communism one of the pre-requisites for being a dictator
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> was being an atheist.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Why?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Because Karl Marx said that religion was the opiate of the people.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> And...?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Religious people were not allowed to be Communist dictators.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cite?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Well, just go ahead and list all of the Communist dictators who were
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Christians, Daniel.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thomas M ntzer, for starters.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I have more, but I think even one example destroys your guess that
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> religious people are not allowed to be communist dictators.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> By the way, check out this quote from tienne Cabet: "Communism is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Christianity... it is pure Christianity, before it was corrupted by
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Catholicism."
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Never heard of Thomas Muntzer.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Then this is an opportunity for you to do research. Seek and ye shall find.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Etienne Cabet sent a colony to Nauvoo,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Illinois, to take over the houses left by members of the Church of
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints who were driven from the city by
>>>>>>>>>>>>> mobs. The Communist colony failed.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Irrelevant.
>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>> Well, I do not think it was irrelevant.
>>>>>>>>>> It is irrelevant to whether Christians can be communist and whether
>>>>>>>>>> Christians can become communist dictators.
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> Well, it was not irrelevant at the time, just as it is not irrelevant
>>>>>>>>> now whether independent voters are allowed to run for office in this
>>>>>>>>> country.
>>>>>>>> Um, what?
>>>>>>> Since the election of 1800 political party politicians have passed
>>>>>>> laws at state level designed to keep independent voters from running
>>>>>>> for public office.
>>>>>> What has that got to do with Christian Communistic Dictators?
>>>>>> (And independent voters can't run for public office?! WHAT?!)
>>>>>> --
>>>>> Political party politicians are passing laws as we speak to prevent
>>>>> independent voters from running for office. In Arizona, the state
>>>>> where I live, an independent voter is required to obtain about 20,000
>>>>> nomination petition signatures to appear on the ballot for the same
>>>>> office a major party candidate is required to obtain 3,000 signatures
>>>>> to appear on the ballot.
>>>>> States like Alabama, Oregon, and Pennsylvania have been passing
>>>>> similar laws designed to insure that independent voters cannot compete
>>>>> with party candidates for ballot access.
>>>> So, you lied when you said that independent voters were denied from
>>>> running for public office.
>>> Independent voters are denied from running for public office, and have
>>> been denied from running for public office since the election of 1800.
>> So, all I need to do is to show one independent voter that did run for
>> public office and your claim will be demolished, right?
>>
>> Karen M. Hartley-Nagle (Independent) ran for public office in 2006.
>>
>> Now what do you have to say for yourself?
>>
> Are you sure that Karen M. Hartley-Nagle was an independent voter?

In 2006, she was.

> Most people who run for office as independent candidates are maverick
> party candidates, like Joseph Lieberman just did in Connecticutt.

But they don't have to be.  All they have to do is to register as an 
independent.

Bernie Sanders (I-VT) is actually IN CONGRESS RIGHT NOW!

> Most independent voters do not have the means to meet the requirements
> for ballot access that party politicians have imposed.

Most PEOPLE do not have the means to meet the requirements for ballot 
access that the party politicians have imposed.


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*          DanielSan -- alt.atheism #2226          *
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* Can God create a Thai dish so spicy that even He *
* can't eat it?                                    *
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