🚀 go-pugleaf

rbwinn wrote:
> On Jul 3, 4:52 am, The Natural Philosopher <a...@b.c> wrote:
>> rbwinn wrote:
>>> On Jul 3, 4:08�am, The Natural Philosopher <a...@b.c> wrote:
>>>> Steve O wrote:
>>>>> "BuddyThunder" <nos...@paradise.net.nz> wrote in message
>>>>> news:486c4bcc$1@clear.net.nz...
>>>>>> rbwinn wrote:
>>>>>>> God has eternal life, something atheists do not believe in and do not
>>>>>>> want. �The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints teaches that
>>>>>>> members will inherit all that the Father hath if they are faithful,
>>>>>>> which means that members of the church will also inherit eternal
>>>>>>> life. �So members of the church can become like God, something that
>>>>>>> was commanded also in the New Testament. � Be ye therefore perfect,
>>>>>>> even as your Father which is in Heaven is perfect. �So there is
>>>>>>> nothing new in any of these doctrines. �They were taught by Jesus
>>>>>>> Christ in his lifetime.
>>>>>> We would probably want it if it could be shown to be anything other
>>>>>> than wishful thinking.
>>>>> I wouldn't want it at all.
>>>>> What the hell are going to do on your
>>>>> 1000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,00­�0,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,­0�00,000,000,000,000th
>>>>> day in eternity that you haven't already done a million times already?
>>>>> Good grief, you'd be bored shitless, if not driven insane by the sheer,
>>>>> mind-numbing boredom.
>>>> Ah, but its eternity. It's timeless.
>>>> Actually this stuff all makes perfect sense to me, but not in the
>>>> context of a supernatural being..unless you want to call the Universe such.
>>>> The original philosophers and shamans who tried to describe the world
>>>> were not stupid: they just lacked the vocabulary.
>>>> For stupidity, you have to come down past the political religions like
>>>> Christianity, to the mere followers like our Robbo, who hasn't really
>>>> got a clue about the philosophy and mysticism that underlies the belief
>>>> set and worldview he so desperately clings to.
>>>> Religious texts are well worthy of study as long as you throw away the
>>>> interpretations of *churches*.
>>>> I've skimmed most of the worlds esoteric knowledge base..I eschewed
>>>> Christianity because it was so blatantly stupid, until last. Then I
>>>> found that it had much in common with other world religions: There is in
>>>> all a basic structure that pertains to something. Its just that
>>>> Christianity, and Islam, have both overlaid it with a huge amount of
>>>> utter rubbish that they insist is the pure literal truth.
>>>> You will get a far more interesting slant on religion from an atheist:
>>>> who may have actually stuidied the subject dispassionately: with a
>>>> Christian or Muslim (excluding the Dervish movement) its a package deal,
>>>> by and large, Buy it or not. There is no room for understanding: Just FAITH.
>>>> But Faith is just a small tool on one step of a ladder of understanding.
>>>> Not the be all and end all of it.
>>>> Its like science, where people want to be told 'whatever is the case'
>>>> (Wittgenstein). The truth is no one knows. We are also operating in
>>>> ultimate ignorance, using a set of rules and tools that produce results,
>>>> without any real confirmation that those rules and tools have any real
>>>> correlation with the underlying reality (if indeed there is such) of the
>>>> universe.
>>>> It gets worse. Largely reality is *what you think it is* because so much
>>>> of it is interpreted into your worldview and belief system: enough so
>>>> that an Epiphany CAN totally change someones subjective life: that
>>>> little trick is traded on by every priest there ever has been..to
>>>> demonstrate the reality of their particular brand of snake oil.
>>>> I can levitate certain objects. Sounds impressive, and so it would be to
>>>> a stone age man. You would instantly spot the remote control devices in
>>>> my hand...;-) HOWEVER I could in principle use that as the basis of a
>>>> system to impress hunter gatherers that I had direct access to whatever
>>>> power they believed existed already, and thereby create a religion and
>>>> my own position in it.
>>>> Its been done so many times..
>>>> Don't throw out babies with bathwater: Religious material has matter of
>>>> interest. Just bypass the interpretations of the Faithful, and make up
>>>> your own mind.
>>>> Eternity is a state of mind in which the faculty to organise things in
>>>> an event stream is not operating. You can by one or more of various
>>>> approaches experience this yourself. To the practitioner this leads to a
>>>> possible conclusions that time itself is a anthropocentric issue: it is
>>>> not an absolute. Remove life, and you remove time. Ergo after death
>>>> there is eternity. �In a sense.
>>>> Or to say it in another way, the totality of the experience of life can
>>>> be transformed via something akin to �Fourier transform, in which the
>>>> time element is transmuted into a position in some other dimension
>>>> somewhat like 'frequency' or 'colour'. .. a co-ordinate system that
>>>> encapsulates the totality of a lifetime as a single pattern in which the
>>>> time element is not present in terms of linear progression of events.
>>>> We don't normally operate in that mode: but many people will assure you
>>>> that we CAN. "my whole life passed before my eyes in an instant" says
>>>> the drowning man..its from experiences such as this that the concepts of
>>>> the old shamans were born, transmuted and corrupted by years of
>>>> translation and repetition into the utter garbage you find in the Bible.- Hide quoted text -
>>>> - Show quoted text -
>>> I think that Jesus Christ would be the best one to explain your idea
>>> to.
>> I don't have to. He knew all about it already, and tried to explain,
>> sadly no one really was listening. So they hung him on a cross to shut
>> him up.
>>
>> But having studied in the East, he knew how to go into ultra deep
>> meditation, so he looked dead enough to be cut down, and with the help
>> of his girlfriend, managed to stay alive long enough to have rampant sex
>> and a few babies.
>>
>> Some of which is documented in the testaments the Romans left OUT of the
>> bible.
>>
>>
>>
>>> Robert B. Winn- Hide quoted text -
>> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
> 
> The Gnostiocs wrote a bunch of garbage about their theory that Jesus
> Christ did not suffer or die on the cross because he was a God.  They
> were trying to combine Christianity with Greek mythology.

Er no. The myth of the resurrected God is in fact part of Mithraism, a 
Roman  cult. That was used by CHRISTIANS to mytholigise their Prophet.

As usual you have it all back to front.

It has its antecedents in shamanic lore and practices of course.

If you want to convince anybody of anything, it helps to have your dcks 
in a row first.




> Robert B. Winn