🚀 go-pugleaf

On Aug 24, 10:41 am, Pentcho Valev <pva...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On 24 Aug, 20:05, Pentcho Valev <pva...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On 24 Aug, 14:37, "qbit" <q...@quantumworldz.com> wrote in
> > sci.physics.relativity:
>
> > > FACT #1:
> > >   A photon emitted at the Earth surface (ignoring air-resistance)
> > >   and going up vertically into the space is SLOWER than a photon
> > >   going straightforward in vacuum space; ie. slower than c.
> > >   Reason: attraction by the Earth gravity.
>
> > > FACT #2:
> > >   A photon emitted in vacuum space and falling down vertically
> > >   to the surface of the Earth (ignoring air-resistance) is FASTER
> > >   than a photon going straightforward in vacuum space; ie. faster than c.
> > >   Reason: attraction by the Earth gravity.
>
> > > Ergo, FACT #3:
> > >   In gravitational fields the real speed of light differs from c.
> > >   It can be even faster than c! The direction is important, see above.
> > >   (Remember: c is just a manmade definition of a constant!).
>
> > > Ergo, FACT #4:
> > >   Due to the equivalence principle (accelleration/deceleration is like
> > >   gravity and vice versa), the speed of light in accellerated/decelerated
> > >   frames differs from c. It can be even faster than c! It depends on
> > >   accelleration/deceleration and of course on the direction of the emitted light.
> > >   (Remember: c is just a manmade definition of a constant!).
>
> > > Ergo, FACT #5:
> > >   What's valid for photons is of course also valid for anything else!
> > >   (except that each particle type and macroscopic objects can have
> > >   their own characteristic MaxSpeed, even beyond c).
>
> > > Ergo, FACT #6:
> > >   Everybody who says different is a charlatan.
> > >   These facts speak for itself. We ordinary people call this kind of reasoning
> > >   LOGIC, something that seems like from outer space to most Relativists!  :-)
>
> > Half of the hypnotists in Einstein criminal cult would agree with you
> > and may even suggest that the gravitational redshift is a consequence
> > of the variability of the speed of light:
>
> > Tom Roberts wrote in sci.physics.relativity:
>
> > > Pentcho Valev wrote:
> > > > CAN THE SPEED OF LIGHT EXCEED 300000 km/s IN A GRAVITATIONAL FIELD?
> > > Sure, depending on the physical conditions of the measurement. It can
> > > also be less than "300000 km/s" (by which I assume you really mean the
> > > standard value for c). And this can happen even for an accelerated
> > > observer in a region without any significant gravitation (e.g. in
> > > Minkowski spacetime).
> > > Tom Roberts tjrobe...@lucent.com
>
> >http://www.physlink.com/Education/AskExperts/ae13.cfm"So, it is
> > absolutely true that the speed of light is _not_ constant in a
> > gravitational field [which, by the equivalence principle, applies as
> > well to accelerating (non-inertial) frames of reference].......Indeed,
> > this is exactly how Einstein did the calculation in: 'On the Influence
> > of Gravitation on the Propagation of Light,' Annalen der Physik, 35,
> > 1911. which predated the full formal development of general relativity
> > by about four years. This paper is widely available in English. You
> > can find a copy beginning on page 99 of the Dover book 'The Principle
> > of Relativity.' You will find in section 3 of that paper, Einstein's
> > derivation of the (variable) speed of light in a gravitational
> > potential, eqn (3). The result is, c' = c0 ( 1 + V / c^2 ) where V is
> > the gravitational potential relative to the point where the speed of
> > light c0 is measured."
>
> >http://www.blazelabs.com/f-g-gcont.asp"The first confirmation of a
> > long range variation in the speed of light travelling in space came in
> > 1964. Irwin Shapiro, it seems, was the first to make use of a
> > previously forgotten facet of general relativity theory -- that the
> > speed of light is reduced when it passes through a gravitational
> > field....Faced with this evidence, Einstein stated:"In the second
> > place our result shows that, according to the general theory of
> > relativity, the law of the constancy of the velocity of light in
> > vacuo, which constitutes one of the two fundamental assumptions in the
> > special theory of relativity and to which we have already frequently
> > referred, cannot claim any unlimited validity. A curvature of rays of
> > light can only take place when the velocity of propagation of light
> > varies with position."......Today we find that since the Special
> > Theory of Relativity unfortunately became part of the so called
> > mainstream science, it is considered a sacrilege to even suggest that
> > the speed of light be anything other than a constant. This is somewhat
> > surprising since even Einstein himself suggested in a paper "On the
> > Influence of Gravitation on the Propagation of Light," Annalen der
> > Physik, 35, 1911, that the speed of light might vary with the
> > gravitational potential. Indeed, the variation of the speed of light
> > in a vacuum or space is explicitly shown in Einstein's calculation for
> > the angle at which light should bend upon the influence of gravity.
> > One can find his calculation in his paper. The result is c'=c(1+V/c^2)
> > where V is the gravitational potential relative to the point where the
> > measurement is taken. 1+V/c^2 is also known as the GRAVITATIONAL
> > REDSHIFT FACTOR."
>
> > The other half of the hypnotists in Einstein criminal cult are more
> > conservative - according to them, in both the presence and absence of
> > a gravitational field the speed of light is constant and that's it.
> > They may tell you that the gravitational redshift is a consequence of
> > time dilation:
>
> >http://www.astronomynotes.com/relativity/s4.htm"Prediction: light
> > escaping from a large mass should lose energy---the wavelength must
> > increase since the speed of light is constant. Stronger surface
> > gravity produces a greater increase in the wavelength. This is a
> > consequence of time dilation. Suppose person A on the massive object
> > decides to send light of a specific frequency f to person B all of the
> > time. So every second, f wave crests leave person A. The same wave
> > crests are received by person B in an interval of time interval of
> > (1+z) seconds. He receives the waves at a frequency of f/(1+z).
> > Remember that the speed of light c = (the frequency f)   (the
> > wavelength L). If the frequency is reduced by (1+z) times, the
> > wavelength must INcrease by (1+z) times: L_atB = (1+z)   L_atA. In the
> > doppler effect, this lengthening of the wavelength is called a
> > redshift. For gravity, the effect is called a GRAVITATIONAL REDSHIFT."
>
> Another hypnotist claiming the speed of light is constant in a
> gravitational field:
>
> http://helios.gsfc.nasa.gov/qa_sp_gr.html
> "Is light affected by gravity? If so, how can the speed of light be
> constant? Wouldn't the light coming off of the Sun be slower than the
> light we make here? If not, why doesn't light escape a black hole?
> Yes, light is affected by gravity, but not in its speed. General
> Relativity (our best guess as to how the Universe works) gives two
> effects of gravity on light. It can bend light (which includes effects
> such as gravitational lensing), and it can change the energy of light.
> But it changes the energy by shifting the frequency of the light
> (gravitational redshift) not by changing light speed. Gravity bends
> light by warping space so that what the light beam sees as "straight"
> is not straight to an outside observer. The speed of light is still
> constant." Dr. Eric Christian
>
> You may note that hypnotists claiming the speed of light in a
> gravitational field is constant are sillier than those claiming it is
> variable.
>
> Pentcho Valev

I agree, those 2D quantum string like photons have mass, and by now
photons may even have as much as a 1e100:1 advantage in numbers more
than atoms.
- Brad Guth