🚀 go-pugleaf

In article <4jf83a$phv@nyx10.cs.du.edu>, M <anon1167@nyx10.cs.du.edu> wrote:
>
>I am on my second postdoc and want to escape into the real world, but 
>there is one small problem.  In order to get this position, I had to sign 
>a "repayment agreement".  This must be something new, because I did not 
>have to sign one at my first post-doc.  Basically, it states for each 


If you're refering to a payback agreement signed when put on a 
training grant, this is nothing new and the federal government
will enforce it, garnishing your wages like they would if you 
failed to pay back a student loan or whatever. 

If your stipend off your first post-doc was paid off a PI's grant 
or off a competitive fellowship awarded to you (not to the institution
via a training grant) then that explains why you were not asked to
sign the payback agreement forms during your first post-doc.

It's never made sense to me that an amount as pitiful as the stipend
provided by a training grant is subject to payback while other, more 
generous funding, from the same source (NIH) isn't. Then again, we're
talking about the federal government here :( At least my mentor was 
nice and supplemented my training grant funding off of his American
Cancer Society grant. 


>month I work as a postdoc, up to one year, I incur a liability to repay 
>the money should I decide to leave the field and work in something other 
>than medical or health related teaching or research.  For each month 
>after one year, the liability is removed, until at 2 years, there is no 
>repayment liability.  If I were to leave now, after 7 months, I would 
>have to repay 7/12 of what I been paid so far, or about $15,000.


I'm not clear on who asked you to sign the payback agreement. If, in
fact, you are on a training grant, then the first year after the 
termination of your support off the training grant IS applicable to 
your payback period. Is it possible that you're confusing this 
rule with the rule that states that you are not liable for payback
until after the first year of _support_? If I recall correctly, if
you were supported as a postdoc off an NIH training grant for one 
year, then you are not bound by the payback agreement. If you were
supported for two years, then you have to "pay back" one year of
time or some monetary amount which is a fraction of the stipend you
received for that period (which may be 7/12, although I don't 
recall the amount) and if you were supported for 3 (the limit) then
you are liable for 2 years of payback. I am 100% certain that my first
year of work after my training grant support was finished was applied
towards the payback period and I'm also certain that my payback period
was 18 months long after a 2 1/2 year long postdoc (I still have the
payback "balance" sheets sent to me from the NIH at the end of each 
year).

>
>So, my question is, does anyone have any experience with this?  Is it 
>possbile to get out of it?  I have no interest in doing research any 
>more, and teaching would be ok, but finding a job would probably be a 
>problem.
>

Since I did not leave research, I haven't had first hand experience 
with this and satisfied the terms of the payback agreement without 
having to think about it. 

However, I do know of people who have gone into areas
other than research and teaching who got out of the payback agreement by 
demonstrating that their scientific training did equip them for jobs 
in which a science background was important for their work. For 
example, one fellow post-doc joined a consulting firm that analyzed
startup biotech companies for investment firms. I'm certain that
he managed to get that work applied to his payback period, but I'm 
not as clear on how it was handled (i.e. whether he consulted the NIH
about it himself or whether he did it through a lawyer). In any event,
it might be better for you to figure out what you'll end up doing first
and then consult a lawyer if you're unsuccessful in getting the NIH to 
decide in your favor. If it is an NIH payback agreement that you're
refering to, then there is more laxity in what is considered "payback
worthy" than you appear to think there is. 

If you're not on a training grant, then ignore this post :)


Stacy