🚀 go-pugleaf

cramer@optilink.dsccc.com (Clayton Cramer) writes:

> In article <jzeroCxL2Gp.FIx@netcom.com>, Jim Nakamura <jzero@netcom.com> wrote:
> >cramer@optilink.dsccc.com (Clayton Cramer) writes:
> >> It's a tragedy, but it's a tragedy everytime a violent crime takes
> >> place, and you liberals don't seem to be very concerned about knives,
> >> baseball bats, and fists that are used in murder.  Why?
> >
> >	Let's be practical here.  You're not suggesting we
> >	amputate fists, are you?

> No, but there are no laws regulating sale or private possesion of 
> knives or bats.  Why?  Knives and bats are FAR more commonly used
> to commit murder than so-called "assault weapons" and yet we have
> not even a pretense of regulation of these deadly weapons.  Why?

> >	Most European countries have freely accessible knives, bats
> >	and fists but have nowhere near the homicide rate that
> >	we do.  Neither do they have the medical bills.  We are

> Very true.  Because the weapons aren't the cause of our violence
> problem.  

> >	up to our necks in red ink resulting from these uninsured
> >	shootings.

> Really?  Do you have any statistics on this?  Violence is a trivial
> part of public health costs in the U.S.

> >	20 years ago no one ever heard of the gun control movement.
> >	10 years ago people still thought it was a fringe group.

> You are just showing your youth and ignorance of history.  Gun
> control has a long history in the U.S. (though only recently has
> it been aimed at everyone -- it used to be only non-whites that
> were the target).

> >	Now it seems like an inevitability.  Why is it that all 
> >	the opponents of health reform seem to be a bunch of
> >	gun owners who are indifferent to the rising costs
> >	their privilege is costing America while at the same time

> Perhaps because you fascists have no interest in other more serious
> social cost items, like alcohol?  Alcohol deaths and medical expenses
> are about 3x as high as guns -- yet there is no interest in reducing
> availability of alcohol.

	I can't believe it!  You're actually suggesting
	alcohol prohibition?!??

> >	hypocritically whining about how health reform will result
> >	in more taxes?  Don't they realize that they are contributing
> >	to a process that will result in the eventual enactment of 
> >	restrictions on gun ownership?
> >-- 
> >jzero@netcom.com

> You make it sound as though you fascists will let us keep our
> guns in exchange for complete governmental control over the
> health care system.  This is called "salami slice" tactics, and
> is well described by Pastor Niemoller's famous quote about, 
> "First they came for the Communists..."


	What I'm suggesting is that the gun lobby and the
	health reform lobby don't necessarily have to be
	at odds.

	But hey, health reform is an inevitability.  If it
	doesn't happen in 5 years, it'll happen in 10.  So
	is gun control.  You folks need us more than we need
	you.  My advice to the gun lobby is "make alliances
	where you can".


-- 
jzero@netcom.com