🚀 go-pugleaf

In article <01be2acd$282ea380$0765af9d@richb-101>, "Homebuilt LAN" <letters@homebuilt-lan.com> wrote:
> I just checked with GTE and TCI for availability of high speed Internet in
> the Plano, TX area. ...

Thanks for your informative post. You covered a lot of questions many of 
us have been wanting to ask.

>I just checked with GTE and TCI for availability of high speed Internet in
>the Plano, TX area. I discovered ADSL is available now and TCI@Home is set
>to launch on Dec. 30. Here are my options (all speeds are stated in
>bits-per-second).

Plano is a big place.  I think when you say "12/30/98" you may not be
referring to "all of Plano," but bits and pieces of Plano."  For example, I
live in NW Plano, which was "supposed to be" rolled out 12/15/98."  Now we
are part of the 12/30/98 rollout.  Supposedly.

I talked to an installer on the street the other day who informed me it may
be "months" (with a big sigh.) So who knows *when/where* anyone in
particular's house in "Plano" may get installed.

>I have ISDN now 128k/128k u/d for $140/mo ($80 for the ISDN line, $40 for
>ISP + $20 for /29 subnet).
>Based upon what I know today, I will most likely go for TCI@Home if it is
>available to my address by the end of January. Otherwise, I will try ADSL.
>In either case, I won't shutdown the ISDN service until the new service is
>up and proven stable. Finally, as I do even with ISDN, I'll maintain a
>dial-up account with my favorite local ISP.


Me too.  I was like, a few thousand feet "unqualified" (ugh) for ADSL in my
area of Plano, and still have ISDN (which is not looking as good as it used
to for the $$.)

Personally, I may go out and buy a cheap 56.6 modem and save some money till
cable "finally" (I'll believe it when I see it) arrives.  Paying $70 a month
to GTE and $30 to the ISP for ISDN just does not "get it" for me anymore.

Sal Sessa / Dallas
________________
sal@salsessa.com
http://www.salsessa.com

Hmmm, one of my friends was trying to set up ADSL in his house in Plano and
was told that Plano uses fiber optic cables and that they are incompatible
with ADSL.  Anyone has other info?

J.L.

Jason <mmx225@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:75gpp7$14j$1@remarQ.com...
>Hmmm, one of my friends was trying to set up ADSL in his house in Plano and
>was told that Plano uses fiber optic cables and that they are incompatible
>with ADSL.  Anyone has other info?

I am in a 11 year old house in Plano near Legacy and Alma. ADSL works fine
here. 972-517-xxxx

On Sat, 19 Dec 1998 08:38:32 -0600, "Sal Sessa" <sal@salsessa.com>
wrote:
[...]
>Plano is a big place.  I think when you say "12/30/98" you may not be
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>referring to "all of Plano," but bits and pieces of Plano."  For example, I
>live in NW Plano, which was "supposed to be" rolled out 12/15/98."  Now we
>are part of the 12/30/98 rollout.  Supposedly.

That so. It's just another Dallas suburb and flooding these newsgroups
with this local crap that SB covered in something more local, is
abuse. 

Hint; put 'Dallas TX' or Dallas TX(plano) in the subject line. That
way, the vast majority of the readership who don't know Plano from
Draino,  can ignore the message.
It's just a matter on common courtesy. 


  Bob Nixon bigrex@home.com
�  dasplat@aztec.asu.edu
http://members.home.net/bigrex/

>Hint; put 'Dallas TX' or Dallas TX(plano) in the subject line. That
>way, the vast majority of the readership who don't know Plano from
>Draino,  can ignore the message.
>It's just a matter on common courtesy.


Uh, the subject line says "PLANO."  If you are not interested, just skip it.

Who asked your opinion anyway?  What are you you, the monitor?

Duhhhh.

Sal Sessa / Dallas
________________
sal@salsessa.com
http://www.salsessa.com

I'll second that!

Mike

Sal Sessa wrote in message <75h7nl$li5$1@newshost.cyberramp.net>...
>
>>Hint; put 'Dallas TX' or Dallas TX(plano) in the subject line. That
>>way, the vast majority of the readership who don't know Plano from
>>Draino,  can ignore the message.
>>It's just a matter on common courtesy.
>
>
>Uh, the subject line says "PLANO."  If you are not interested, just skip
it.
>
>Who asked your opinion anyway?  What are you you, the monitor?
>
>Duhhhh.
>
>Sal Sessa / Dallas
>________________
>sal@salsessa.com
>http://www.salsessa.com
>
>

On Sat, 19 Dec 1998 16:00:50 -0600, "Sal Sessa" <sal@salsessa.com>
wrote:

>
>>Hint; put 'Dallas TX' or Dallas TX(plano) in the subject line. That
>>way, the vast majority of the readership who don't know Plano from
>>Draino,  can ignore the message.
>>It's just a matter on common courtesy.
>
>
>Uh, the subject line says "PLANO."  If you are not interested, just skip it.

Plano could well be mistaken for some technical term and the subject
line was so long that the TX got truncated. Besides you Texans are soo
gauche -:)
  Bob Nixon bigrex@home.com
�  dasplat@aztec.asu.edu
http://members.home.net/bigrex/

On 18 Dec 1998 21:28:18 GMT, "Homebuilt LAN"
<letters@homebuilt-lan.com> wrote:

>I just checked with GTE and TCI for availability of high speed Internet in
>the Plano, TX area. I discovered ADSL is available now and TCI@Home is set
>to launch on Dec. 30. Here are my options (all speeds are stated in
>bits-per-second).
>
>I have ISDN now 128k/128k u/d for $140/mo ($80 for the ISDN line, $40 for
>ISP + $20 for /29 subnet).
>
>GTE tells me they will check the line quality if I ask to sign-up. Until
>then, they can't be sure ADSL is available to my address. Their packages
>are show below. In all cases, GTE is the ISP.
>
>64k/256k u/d for $60/mo
>384k/384k u/d for $99/mo
>768k/768k u/d for $200/mo
>
>TCI cable modem with @Home as the ISP
>
>128k/1544k u/d for $39.95

Consider yourself lucky.  Over here in Lewisville, ADSL is the only
option.  GTE knows this and thus charges obscene rates for internet
access ($210/month for 1.5Mbit).  I've talked with TCI several times
and have since discovered they don't even service Lewisville.

Remember, you don't have to get your feed from gte.net.  Cyberramp is also
offereing ADSL via GTE lines at about 50% off gte's rates.  There are also a
handful of other ISP's offereing ADSL service.  I'm still waiting on my CO
in Lewisville to be ADSL ready (been pushed back again to mid-Jan 1999) but
have been checking around for service.

Loge wrote in message
<31B0EE6A238685A6.450CD834490FE26A.674AEFC9419371AB@library-proxy.airnews.ne
t>...
>On 18 Dec 1998 21:28:18 GMT, "Homebuilt LAN"
><letters@homebuilt-lan.com> wrote:
>
>>I just checked with GTE and TCI for availability of high speed Internet in
>>the Plano, TX area. I discovered ADSL is available now and TCI@Home is set
>>to launch on Dec. 30. Here are my options (all speeds are stated in
>>bits-per-second).
>>
>>I have ISDN now 128k/128k u/d for $140/mo ($80 for the ISDN line, $40 for
>>ISP + $20 for /29 subnet).
>>
>>GTE tells me they will check the line quality if I ask to sign-up. Until
>>then, they can't be sure ADSL is available to my address. Their packages
>>are show below. In all cases, GTE is the ISP.
>>
>>64k/256k u/d for $60/mo
>>384k/384k u/d for $99/mo
>>768k/768k u/d for $200/mo
>>
>>TCI cable modem with @Home as the ISP
>>
>>128k/1544k u/d for $39.95
>
>Consider yourself lucky.  Over here in Lewisville, ADSL is the only
>option.  GTE knows this and thus charges obscene rates for internet
>access ($210/month for 1.5Mbit).  I've talked with TCI several times
>and have since discovered they don't even service Lewisville.

On Mon, 21 Dec 1998 13:26:38 -0600, "Gary Hasty"
<gary.hasty@telops.gte.com> wrote:

>Remember, you don't have to get your feed from gte.net.  Cyberramp is also
>offereing ADSL via GTE lines at about 50% off gte's rates.  There are also a
>handful of other ISP's offereing ADSL service.  I'm still waiting on my CO
>in Lewisville to be ADSL ready (been pushed back again to mid-Jan 1999) but
>have been checking around for service.

Yes but I still have to get the ADSL line to my house through GTE.  So
by going with Cyberramp for IP vs GTE I might save $30/month but it's
still a complete ripoff compared to cablemodems.  GTE can kiss my ass
if they think I'll pay them 5 times the amount I was paying for a
cablemodem for 1/5th the speed.

Go to the cable company and ask them to GUARANTEE IN WRITING
the speed they quoted you on.  When you are done do the same to an
ASDL provider.  You will find much enlightenment there.

Cable modems are much like LBJ.  The posted speed limit (well for much of it)
is 60.  But I doubt you can go that fast at 7 AM.  Cable modems are the
same.  They told you the maximum speed that cable can carry.  They
forgot to tell you you share that with everyone and his brother.   But please,
don't take my word for it.  There are many places on the Internet dealing
with cable companies overloaded systems and the "promised" speeds
disappearing.

Loge wrote:

> On Mon, 21 Dec 1998 13:26:38 -0600, "Gary Hasty"
> <gary.hasty@telops.gte.com> wrote:
>
> >Remember, you don't have to get your feed from gte.net.  Cyberramp is also
> >offereing ADSL via GTE lines at about 50% off gte's rates.  There are also a
> >handful of other ISP's offereing ADSL service.  I'm still waiting on my CO
> >in Lewisville to be ADSL ready (been pushed back again to mid-Jan 1999) but
> >have been checking around for service.
>
> Yes but I still have to get the ADSL line to my house through GTE.  So
> by going with Cyberramp for IP vs GTE I might save $30/month but it's
> still a complete ripoff compared to cablemodems.  GTE can kiss my ass
> if they think I'll pay them 5 times the amount I was paying for a
> cablemodem for 1/5th the speed.

<snip>
>forgot to tell you you share that with everyone and his brother.   But
please,
>don't take my word for it.  There are many places on the Internet dealing
>with cable companies overloaded systems and the "promised" speeds
>disappearing.


So, what's "your" alternative for $40 a month?

Sal Sessa / Dallas
________________
sal@salsessa.com
http://www.salsessa.com

Sal Sessa <sal@salsessa.com> wrote in message
news:76b9pd$bfl$1@newshost.cyberramp.net...
><snip>
>>forgot to tell you you share that with everyone and his brother.   But
>please,
>>don't take my word for it.  There are many places on the Internet dealing
>>with cable companies overloaded systems and the "promised" speeds
>>disappearing.
>
>
>So, what's "your" alternative for $40 a month?

I pay $54.95 per month for 256k/64k ADSL.
I used to pay about $35.00 for 56K modem. These prices include the phone
line but not the unfigurable taxes on the Telco side (unless your a
accountant).

Cable may be worth it considering what one can obtain and desire/afford.

On Tue, 29 Dec 1998 12:48:19 -0600, Mike Miller <mdm@dtx.net> wrote:

>Go to the cable company and ask them to GUARANTEE IN WRITING
>the speed they quoted you on.  When you are done do the same to an
>ASDL provider.  You will find much enlightenment there.
>
>Cable modems are much like LBJ.  The posted speed limit (well for much of it)
>is 60.  But I doubt you can go that fast at 7 AM.  Cable modems are the
>same.  They told you the maximum speed that cable can carry.  They
>forgot to tell you you share that with everyone and his brother.   But please,
>don't take my word for it.  There are many places on the Internet dealing
>with cable companies overloaded systems and the "promised" speeds
>disappearing.

Admittedly, cable averaged about 80-90K/s but it didn't cost
$140/month for such speeds.

If you want to talk about @Home speeds within their intranet, they
were crazy.  I could download MP3's from @Home's news server at
7-8Mbps.

I fail to see how GTE does any ADSL business at all in areas where
cablemodems are in direct competition with them.

In article <61309690707BD472.BDAECBEDB3DC8030.44F2AAE768CC4C41@library-
proxy.airnews.net>, loge@hades.org says...
> On Tue, 29 Dec 1998 12:48:19 -0600, Mike Miller <mdm@dtx.net> wrote:
> 
> >Go to the cable company and ask them to GUARANTEE IN WRITING
> >the speed they quoted you on.  When you are done do the same to an
> >ASDL provider.  You will find much enlightenment there.
> >
> >Cable modems are much like LBJ.  The posted speed limit (well for much of it)
> >is 60.  But I doubt you can go that fast at 7 AM.  Cable modems are the
> >same.  They told you the maximum speed that cable can carry.  They
> >forgot to tell you you share that with everyone and his brother.   But please,
> >don't take my word for it.  There are many places on the Internet dealing
> >with cable companies overloaded systems and the "promised" speeds
> >disappearing.
> 
> Admittedly, cable averaged about 80-90K/s but it didn't cost
> $140/month for such speeds.
> 
> If you want to talk about @Home speeds within their intranet, they
> were crazy.  I could download MP3's from @Home's news server at
> 7-8Mbps.
> 
> I fail to see how GTE does any ADSL business at all in areas where
> cablemodems are in direct competition with them.
> 
 
I use my 768K ADSL Link to run a web server. You can't do that with
a cable modem. I fail to see why anyone would do ISDN instead of 
ADSL for a dedicated link. Also... I trust GTE 1000 times more to 
keep my ADSL link up than I do the cable company. GTE kept my 64K 
ISDN link up for 30+ days at a time. You ever go 30 days without 
a cable interruption? 

jack - jack@cybermail.net - www.cybermail.net 

How much is your 768k DSL connection?


>
>I use my 768K ADSL Link to run a web server. You can't do that with
>a cable modem. I fail to see why anyone would do ISDN instead of
>ADSL for a dedicated link. Also... I trust GTE 1000 times more to
>keep my ADSL link up than I do the cable company. GTE kept my 64K
>ISDN link up for 30+ days at a time. You ever go 30 days without
>a cable interruption?
>
>jack - jack@cybermail.net - www.cybermail.net

[This followup was posted to dfw.internet.providers and a copy was sent 
to the cited author.]

In article <4xXk2.13048$rJ2.1935@news.rdc1.tx.home.com>, 
tbfisher@home.com says...
> How much is your 768k DSL connection?

same price as my old dedicated 64K connection. About $175 plus
tax. A lot more expensive than cable.... but worth it for what
I need it for. Non business accounts with single IP Addresses
are like $120 for a 768K connection. If I was just a web 
surfer... I couldn't justify that -vs- a cable modem, but I'm 
not just a web surfer. When cable modems comes to my area, I may 
even get one of those to use for my net surfin stuff..... but the
original question was something like "Why would anyone want ADSL 
if they could have a cable modem?" I'm not saying that ADSL is 
always better than a cable modem... just that it's better if you
want to do something besides surfin. 

jack - jack@cybermail.net - www.cybermail.net



> >
> >I use my 768K ADSL Link to run a web server. You can't do that with
> >a cable modem. I fail to see why anyone would do ISDN instead of
> >ADSL for a dedicated link. Also... I trust GTE 1000 times more to
> >keep my ADSL link up than I do the cable company. GTE kept my 64K
> >ISDN link up for 30+ days at a time. You ever go 30 days without
> >a cable interruption?
> >
> >jack - jack@cybermail.net - www.cybermail.net
> 
> 
> 

In dfw.internet.providers Jack Snodgrass <jack@cybermail.net> wrote:
> keep my ADSL link up than I do the cable company. GTE kept my 64K 
> ISDN link up for 30+ days at a time. You ever go 30 days without 
> a cable interruption? 

I have been up constantly for over 4 months.

Last night I had a power glitch. 1 computer locked up and the other
2 rebooted, lights flickered, even my hub went crazy, after resetting
all of that...the cable modem was still working. I don't know if it
went down or not, but it worked when I reset everything else.

Regards
Nigel

On Wed, 6 Jan 1999 18:57:48 -0600, jack@cybermail.net (Jack Snodgrass)
wrote:

>I use my 768K ADSL Link to run a web server. You can't do that with
>a cable modem. I fail to see why anyone would do ISDN instead of 
>ADSL for a dedicated link. Also... I trust GTE 1000 times more to 
>keep my ADSL link up than I do the cable company. GTE kept my 64K 
>ISDN link up for 30+ days at a time. You ever go 30 days without 
>a cable interruption? 

Yes, and I've also heard they've lowered the upstream on cable to 128K
instead of the 768K when I had it.  But as far as reliability, my
cablemodem only went out once or twice during the 6 months that I had
it, and then only for an hour or so.

Loge wrote in message
<282A5B75CFFDC465.87268076DAAE4DE6.FCC1312E14C86CEF@library-proxy.airnews.ne
t>...
>On Wed, 6 Jan 1999 18:57:48 -0600, jack@cybermail.net (Jack Snodgrass)
>wrote:
>
>>I use my 768K ADSL Link to run a web server. You can't do that with
>>a cable modem. I fail to see why anyone would do ISDN instead of
>
>Yes, and I've also heard they've lowered the upstream on cable to 128K
>instead of the 768K when I had it.  But as far as reliability, my


    At 128K you can't realistically host a web server.

Don Hancock

>     At 128K you can't realistically host a web server.

That's a surprise to me -- I did it for more than three years, with no
complaints.

>I use my 768K ADSL Link to run a web server. You can't do that with
>a cable modem. I fail to see why anyone would do ISDN instead of
>ADSL for a dedicated link.

How much do you pay for that? I only found one ISP that would let you host a
web site on your DSL service, and they charged extra for it..

C

I understood it to be these newsgroups:
comp.dcom.modems.cable
comp.dcom.xdsl
dfw.internet.providers

When you read the newsgroup comp.dcom.xdsl, you have to look at the
newsgroups listed on each thread to see if it's a crosspost, and thus
determine if the subject may or may not be relevant to yourself.

Examples:
Thread:                             More Flashcom woes (long story)
Newsgroups posted in:  ba.internet,comp.dcom.xdsl

Thread:                             Using PCISYS with US West DSL
Newsgroups posted in:  uswest.dsl,comp.dcom.xdsl

Thread:                             ADSL and analog VPN
Newsgroups posted in:  omp.dcom.xdsl,comp.dcom.lans.ethernet

Thread:                             Re: Atlanta - ADSL Subscribers
Newsgroups posted in:
bellsouth.net.atl.general,bellsouth.net.general,bellsouth.net.support,comp.d
com.xdsl

Mainly, in reference to the original email, Bob Nixon bigrex@home.com
stated:

>>>That so. It's just another Dallas suburb and flooding these newsgroups
>>>with this local crap that SB covered in something more local, is
>>>abuse.
>>>

>>>Hint; put 'Dallas TX' or Dallas TX(plano) in the subject line. That
>>>way, the vast majority of the readership who don't know Plano from
>>>Draino,  can ignore the message.
>>>It's just a matter on common courtesy.

Look at the last example. My phone company is GTE. Some of DFW is SWBell.
But if I acted like Bob, I might post a reply saying "Hey, you need to put
Georgia because is confuses me.  There is an Atlanta, Wyoming and I read
this whole dang thread before I figured out you were talking about a
different phone company..."

The title of the thread is as stated in the subject line "Re: High speed
Internet choices for Plano, Tx".
If we can say that most people post on topic, and since
dfw.internet.providers crosses into the other two newsgroups, would it not
be fair to assume that if I were reading comp.dcom.modems.cable and
comp.dcom.xdsl, that posts with the title "Plano, TX" in the title would be
relevant to dfw.internet.providers?  Since dfw.internet.providers appears in
the newsgroups list on the thread under comp.dcom.xdsl, wouldn't that also
at least _HINT_ that that thread would be relevant to DFW?

For example, examine the thread in comp.dcom.xdsl titled "More Flashcom woes
(long story)". On the thread, the newsgroups listed are:
ba.internet,comp.dcom.xdsl.

It was my understanding, I could be wrong, but most news readers listed the
newsgroups that a thread was crossposted on.

All that being said,  I would hope that Bob Nixon would look to see what a
thread was cross posted to to determine it's relevance to him as an
individual.  I do.

BD wrote in message <77iorv$10q$1@newnews.startext.net>...
>I think you need to educate yourself a bit more...
>dfw.internet.providers is only ONE of the 3 groups you're posting this
>thread to... The other 2 have NOTHING at all to do with the dfw or
metroplex
>areas.. One's cable-modems and the other's xdsl...
>And I assume the complaints are coming from people reading one of those...

Thus, I do not believe my level of "education" may be of issue.  At least, I
don't think so when you take what I posted:

>>Would you friggin' happier if the newsgroup was called
>>"dfwmetroplex.internet.providers".
>>
>>Come on.
>>

in the context of my stance that "news readers and posters ought to take a
thread in context relevant to the name of the newsgroup in which it was
posted".  If I'm wrong, then perhaps someone else could explain to me why
everybody gets so irrate when people post off topic?
It bugs me because when that happens, I perhaps could find a post about
Plano, TX in newsgroup centric to Washington or London.

>
>Chris Norman <chrisn@nospam.com> wrote in message
>news:C2B93F039456C781.93AF1253178AF77F.3822B1BD0B7F495F@library-proxy.airne
w
>s.net...

Would you friggin' happier if the newsgroup was called
"dfwmetroplex.internet.providers".

Come on.


>That so. It's just another Dallas suburb and flooding these newsgroups
>with this local crap that SB covered in something more local, is
>abuse.
>
>Hint; put 'Dallas TX' or Dallas TX(plano) in the subject line. That
>way, the vast majority of the readership who don't know Plano from
>Draino,  can ignore the message.
>It's just a matter on common courtesy.
>

I contacted GTE and all the affiliated DSL providers for the Plano TX area
this week. I don't know how this compares to other markets around the
country.

Here are the results:
DSL line from GTE (Does not include ISP charges, all speeds are in
kilobits/second)
(GTE Service level: Max burst DL, Max burst UL, CIR, Cost/mo.)
Bronze: 256, 64, 10, $35
Silver: 384, 384, 32, $55
Gold: 768, 768, 64, $70
Platinum: 1544, 1544, 192, $100
Platinum Plus: 1544, 1544, 384, $230

CIR = Certified Information Rate. This is the "smoke and mirrors" factor of
xDSL service. CIR is the highest guaranteed sustained throughput in either
direction. Speeds above the quoted CIR are subject to available bandwidth
and prevailing network conditions. In other words, buying a 256/64kbps
connection only guarantees you 10kbps in either direction at any time.

The modem can be purchased from GTE for $300 or rented at $12/mo. ISP costs
are given below for each of the service levels shown above. Add these costs
to the line cost. (Basic service and common add-ons shown also).

August Internet: $23/$33/$53/$83/$93

ConnectNet: $25/$40/$60/$90/(Platinum plus not quoted)
- 1 static IP included
- 8 IP subnet (5 usable) adds $15/month
- *** Browser only service ***
- Absolutely no inbound connections of any kind are allowed. This is not a
misquote. I asked several probing questions about this. The sales rep
stated they have placed packet filters on their routers to reject all
inbound connections. Not even FTP will work on this service according to
their sales rep.

CyberRamp: $24/$34/$54/$84/(Platinum plus not quoted)
- 1 static IP included
- Annual pre-pay discounts are available
- 8 IP subnet (5 usable) adds $29/mo

DirectConnect: $23/$33/$53/$83/(Platinum plus not quoted)
- 17% discount is paid annually
- Service option costs $6/mo allows servers
- 8 IP subnet (5 usable) adds $15/mo, also gets 35MB of web space
- Virtual domain $25 set-up, $10/mo

GTE: $25/$44/$65/$110/(Platinum plus not quoted)

Waymark: $25/$35/$55/$85/$95
- 1 static IP included
- 8 IP subnet (5 usable) adds $15/mo.
- Virtual domain $99 set-up, $99/year.

Commentary:
Given the CIR's (these are set by GTE, not the ISP), only the two top
service levels guarantee bandwidth better than a 2B+D ISDN line. If you
need consistent bandwidth up to 128kbps, ISDN is still your better choice.
the local cost of 128kbps ISDN is $120/mo ($80 for line, $40 for ISP). It
is not until the Platinum service level ($100/mo for line, avg. $55/mo for
ISP) does the guaranteed bandwidth exceed that of ISDN. If your traffic is
"bursty" and constancy is not important, DSL or (better yet) cable modem
could be cost effective. For reliable throughput, buy ISDN.

One final comment. With a CIR of only 10kbps, the Bronze service level is
too low to be a real product. IMHO this should be dropped from their price
list completely. Even the Silver plan is marginal as it will give about the
same throughput as a 56kbps dial-up modem but at twice the cost (assuming
$30/mo telco and $20/mo ISP). The DSL connection will be far more stable
than dial-up. However, is it worth the cost?

Hope this helps. Enjoy!
-- 
Homebuilt LAN - The Newsletter for the Networked Home User
http://www.homebuilt-lan.com
faq@homebuilt-lan.com

I just recently learned about the CIR stuff... sounds similar to cable modem
limitations due to a lot of users using them at the same time. I did not
expect such a limitation to occur with ADSL. I guess an ADSL line will slow
down as more users in an area get ADSL as well.

The 10, 32, and 64 are pretty rediculously low in my opinion. 10 and 32 are
even less than most modems can do!

I'm definitely going to stick with my ISDN for a while longer. The CIR was
really disappointing to find out about.

Homebuilt LAN wrote in message <01be3fe6$e2d23ed0$0765af9d@richb-101>...
>I contacted GTE and all the affiliated DSL providers for the Plano TX area
>this week. I don't know how this compares to other markets around the
>country.
>
>Here are the results:
>DSL line from GTE (Does not include ISP charges, all speeds are in
>kilobits/second)
>(GTE Service level: Max burst DL, Max burst UL, CIR, Cost/mo.)
>Bronze: 256, 64, 10, $35
>Silver: 384, 384, 32, $55
>Gold: 768, 768, 64, $70
>Platinum: 1544, 1544, 192, $100
>Platinum Plus: 1544, 1544, 384, $230
>
>CIR = Certified Information Rate. This is the "smoke and mirrors" factor of
>xDSL service. CIR is the highest guaranteed sustained throughput in either
>direction. Speeds above the quoted CIR are subject to available bandwidth
>and prevailing network conditions. In other words, buying a 256/64kbps
>connection only guarantees you 10kbps in either direction at any time.
>
>The modem can be purchased from GTE for $300 or rented at $12/mo. ISP costs
>are given below for each of the service levels shown above. Add these costs
>to the line cost. (Basic service and common add-ons shown also).
>
>August Internet: $23/$33/$53/$83/$93
>
>ConnectNet: $25/$40/$60/$90/(Platinum plus not quoted)
>- 1 static IP included
>- 8 IP subnet (5 usable) adds $15/month
>- *** Browser only service ***
>- Absolutely no inbound connections of any kind are allowed. This is not a
>misquote. I asked several probing questions about this. The sales rep
>stated they have placed packet filters on their routers to reject all
>inbound connections. Not even FTP will work on this service according to
>their sales rep.
>
>CyberRamp: $24/$34/$54/$84/(Platinum plus not quoted)
>- 1 static IP included
>- Annual pre-pay discounts are available
>- 8 IP subnet (5 usable) adds $29/mo
>
>DirectConnect: $23/$33/$53/$83/(Platinum plus not quoted)
>- 17% discount is paid annually
>- Service option costs $6/mo allows servers
>- 8 IP subnet (5 usable) adds $15/mo, also gets 35MB of web space
>- Virtual domain $25 set-up, $10/mo
>
>GTE: $25/$44/$65/$110/(Platinum plus not quoted)
>
>Waymark: $25/$35/$55/$85/$95
>- 1 static IP included
>- 8 IP subnet (5 usable) adds $15/mo.
>- Virtual domain $99 set-up, $99/year.
>
>Commentary:
>Given the CIR's (these are set by GTE, not the ISP), only the two top
>service levels guarantee bandwidth better than a 2B+D ISDN line. If you
>need consistent bandwidth up to 128kbps, ISDN is still your better choice.
>the local cost of 128kbps ISDN is $120/mo ($80 for line, $40 for ISP). It
>is not until the Platinum service level ($100/mo for line, avg. $55/mo for
>ISP) does the guaranteed bandwidth exceed that of ISDN. If your traffic is
>"bursty" and constancy is not important, DSL or (better yet) cable modem
>could be cost effective. For reliable throughput, buy ISDN.
>
>One final comment. With a CIR of only 10kbps, the Bronze service level is
>too low to be a real product. IMHO this should be dropped from their price
>list completely. Even the Silver plan is marginal as it will give about the
>same throughput as a 56kbps dial-up modem but at twice the cost (assuming
>$30/mo telco and $20/mo ISP). The DSL connection will be far more stable
>than dial-up. However, is it worth the cost?
>
>Hope this helps. Enjoy!
>--
>Homebuilt LAN - The Newsletter for the Networked Home User
>http://www.homebuilt-lan.com
>faq@homebuilt-lan.com
>
>

In article <01be3fe6$e2d23ed0$0765af9d@richb-101>,
Homebuilt LAN <faq@homebuilt-lan.com> wrote:
>ConnectNet: $25/$40/$60/$90/(Platinum plus not quoted)
>- Absolutely no inbound connections of any kind are allowed. This is not a
>misquote. I asked several probing questions about this. The sales rep
>stated they have placed packet filters on their routers to reject all
>inbound connections. Not even FTP will work on this service according to
>their sales rep.

  Should be renamed NoConnectNet

>CyberRamp: $24/$34/$54/$84/(Platinum plus not quoted)
>- 1 static IP included
>- Annual pre-pay discounts are available
>- 8 IP subnet (5 usable) adds $29/mo

  This is what I'm using (w/ Bronze)  I get pretty consistent 20-25 Kbytes/s
  transfers (quake pings in the 60-90 range)

>
>One final comment. With a CIR of only 10kbps, the Bronze service level is
>too low to be a real product. IMHO this should be dropped from their price
>list completely. Even the Silver plan is marginal as it will give about the
>same throughput as a 56kbps dial-up modem but at twice the cost (assuming
>$30/mo telco and $20/mo ISP). The DSL connection will be far more stable
>than dial-up. However, is it worth the cost?

  I'll get back to you when this actually becomes a problem.
  Right now, I'll enjoy my cheap, fast internet access.  i.e.
  I've never seen access that slow on my bronze line.

-- 
--
=================
cannon@netcom.com

Homebuilt LAN wrote in message <01be3fe6$e2d23ed0$0765af9d@richb-101>...
>I contacted GTE and all the affiliated DSL providers for the Plano TX area
>this week. I don't know how this compares to other markets around the
>country.
>
[stuff deleted]
>
>CIR = Certified Information Rate. This is the "smoke and mirrors" factor of
>xDSL service. CIR is the highest guaranteed sustained throughput in either
>direction. Speeds above the quoted CIR are subject to available bandwidth
>and prevailing network conditions. In other words, buying a 256/64kbps
>connection only guarantees you 10kbps in either direction at any time.
>
[more stuff deleted]
>
>One final comment. With a CIR of only 10kbps, the Bronze service level is
>too low to be a real product. IMHO this should be dropped from their price
>list completely. Even the Silver plan is marginal as it will give about the
>same throughput as a 56kbps dial-up modem but at twice the cost (assuming
>$30/mo telco and $20/mo ISP). The DSL connection will be far more stable
>than dial-up. However, is it worth the cost?
>


Southwestern Bell (SBC Communications, http://www.swbell.com/) has just
announced their ADSL rates and time-frames.  For $39.00/month their offering
1544 downstream and 384 upstream with a minimum rate of 384.  They're also
going to offer a 6Mbps/384bps version.  They also mention that they are
thinking of putting this with their ISP service for a total of $49.00/month.

Now, am I just reading this wrong or is this going to change the whole
ballgame?  http://www.swbell.com/Catalog/Product_Detail/DSL/faqs.html


-DF

I could not find the rates on the Prices page. Also, I think it is 1.5 Mb
down and 128 up, not 384 up. But if the prices are as good as you say, I'm
excited... :-)

>
>
>Southwestern Bell (SBC Communications, http://www.swbell.com/) has just
>announced their ADSL rates and time-frames.  For $39.00/month their
offering
>1544 downstream and 384 upstream with a minimum rate of 384.  They're also
>going to offer a 6Mbps/384bps version.  They also mention that they are
>thinking of putting this with their ISP service for a total of
$49.00/month.
>
>Now, am I just reading this wrong or is this going to change the whole
>ballgame?  http://www.swbell.com/Catalog/Product_Detail/DSL/faqs.html
>
>
>-DF
>
>

In article <cannonF5KMwB.7J3@netcom.com>,
  cannon@netcom.com (Chris Cannon) wrote:

>   This is what I'm using (w/ Bronze)  I get pretty consistent 20-25 Kbytes/s
>   transfers (quake pings in the 60-90 range)
>

Ping 60-90ms, that's great; almost lan speeds. I don't expect latency to be
any different for different xdsl bandwidths. I've heard cable modems are less
reliable on this front. Does anyone have first-hand experience with this? A
lot of people don't realize this factor is far more important than bandwidth
when it comes to games. I'm beginning to sway back toward XDSL for this
reason, and the web-hosting restrictions on cable-modem (I've also heard that
the IP address is not really guaranteed static for cable-modem especially if
you shut down, whereas the xdsl ip is. Is this true?).

I think I could get bronze service for now, and upgrade to silver if bandwidth
becomes a problem.

-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
http://www.dejanews.com/       Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own    

http://public.swbell.net/press/dsl.html

Sorry!  There's the link to the page with prices!

"but the connection speed will be at a guaranteed minimum of 384 Kbps"


Albert Wiersch wrote in message
<9ACD4822D84CA297.104A9EEB2D5E6AE6.DABD22760CD99D91@library-proxy.airnews.ne
t>...
>
>I could not find the rates on the Prices page. Also, I think it is 1.5 Mb
>down and 128 up, not 384 up. But if the prices are as good as you say, I'm
>excited... :-)
>
>>
>>
>>Southwestern Bell (SBC Communications, http://www.swbell.com/) has just
>>announced their ADSL rates and time-frames.  For $39.00/month their
>offering
>>1544 downstream and 384 upstream with a minimum rate of 384.  They're also
>>going to offer a 6Mbps/384bps version.  They also mention that they are
>>thinking of putting this with their ISP service for a total of
>$49.00/month.
>>
>>Now, am I just reading this wrong or is this going to change the whole
>>ballgame?  http://www.swbell.com/Catalog/Product_Detail/DSL/faqs.html
>>
>>
>>-DF
>>
>>
>
>

On 14 Jan 1999 17:54:44 GMT, "Homebuilt LAN" <faq@homebuilt-lan.com>
wrote:

>One final comment. With a CIR of only 10kbps, the Bronze service level is
>too low to be a real product. IMHO this should be dropped from their price
>list completely. Even the Silver plan is marginal as it will give about the
>same throughput as a 56kbps dial-up modem but at twice the cost (assuming
>$30/mo telco and $20/mo ISP). The DSL connection will be far more stable
>than dial-up. However, is it worth the cost?

You do know the difference between kilobits and kilobytes, don't you?
I thought so....

BD wrote in message <781dga$baf$1@newnews.startext.net>...
>>Would you friggin' happier if the newsgroup was called
>>"dfwmetroplex.internet.providers".
>
>Remember saying that? THAT it what I replied to...
>Sure sounds like you're trying to cover your tracks (ie trying to make it
>sound as if you already knew you were cross-posting)...
>Else, what you said, well.. hardly makes any sense...


Ok.

Albert Wiersch wrote:

> I could not find the rates on the Prices page. Also, I think it is 1.5 Mb
> down and 128 up, not 384 up. But if the prices are as good as you say, I'm
> excited... :-)

I talked to a SWB salesman (I'm in the St. Louis metro area) who said the
website is wrong.  It's 1.5/384 for $129 a month  and 384/384 for $39 a month.
$10 extra for Internet access.  The salesman, although generally knowledgable
about xDSL, couldn't answer any questions about dynamic or static IP's for the
Internet service.

Oh, all of this is pending approval by Missouri's PSC.

Walt...