🚀 go-pugleaf

In article <31A08DA8.536B@blizzard.gaffaneys.com>,
Tony Bruno  <tbruno@blizzard.gaffaneys.com> wrote:
>PangK wrote:
>> 
>>   Does the name BOBBY PACKWOOD mean anything to you?
>> Working for THAT champion of women's rights meant he had to
>> feel your tits daily! Or women's rights advocate Teddy Kennedy who
>> rapes witresses in resturants under the table.... THAT is what I mean.
>> I've seen LOTS of these men. ALL of them I have met want ONE THING
>> PUSSY! Which is why they hang around women saying ANYTHING the girls want
>> to hear! The saddest part is that IT WORKS!
>
>
>To deny that men like this exist would be foolish.  Conversely, to 
>declare that *no* man that believes in Women's Rights is expressing a 
>genuine concern and is only after the proverbial "one thing" is both 
>ignorant and dangerous.

I agree completely!  My husband has *always* believed in WOmen's Rights,
long before I met him and for the past 30 years as well.  His record
shows a definite interest in promoting women in the academic world
for their *skills* and experience and NOT their skirt length or bust
size.

>Case in point:  My wife has most of the requirements called for by big 
>business to make it in corporate America.  She's relatively young (29), 
>attractive, has ten years work experience, including time as a 
>supervisor in a goverment facility, has held a national security 
>clearance (without being an armed services veteran, mind you), and has 
>even been a partner in a desktop publishing firm.  She holds a BA in 
>English, which she acknowledges is not as "sexy" as a BS in Computer 
>Science, but she makes up for that fact by being extremely computer 
>literate.  She currently holds the position as a Senior Computer 
>Consultant at a corporate supplier in Grand Forks, ND.  This makes her 
>succesful, right?
>
>Hardly.

I knew you were going to say that.  Why?  Because it has been MY
experience as well.

>When my wife graduated from college in 1993, we decided to chance a move 
>to the Denver Metro area in order to improve our long-term economic 
>position.  It was a tough decision; I opted to hold off on my last year 
>of college in order to make the move, as my wife was literally being 
>offered only retail jobs in Grand Forks.  We did the headhunter thing, 
>and -- unlike a surprising number of our peers -- hit the bricks to make 
>opportunities for ourselves.  After three months of hard searching, the 
>*only* offer she got (after the only interview she received, mind you) 
>was that of a receptionist at an electronic components supply company.  
>She was placed in charge of the computer equipment, handled phones, and 
>made a whopping $8.50/hour to start.  Eventually, she made $9.60/hour, 
>but was passed over for promotions twice in favor of people with half 
>the experience and education and, apparently, half the material to make 
>their skirts.  She looked for other positions, but they never panned 
>out.  She was either overqualified, underqualified, or simply "not what 
>we're looking for."

Not that I'm complaining (I'm really not), BUT the fact that women
with MUCH more education and skills than I have (I do secretarial
work), are being hired in secretarial jobs, makes it not only *nasty*
for those like your wife, but also extremely difficult for those like
myself.  (And by the way, I too have heard the "overqualified" bit.)

>What does this have to do with Women's Rights?  Well, while my wife was 
>slogging away, I was looking for a job to "help pay the bills" before I 
>went back to school.  I figured that, without a college degree, I would 
>be offered garbage, so I was prepared for the worst.  Instead, I 
>interviewed to the final level for two jobs making in excess of 
>$35,000.00/year, turned down two $10.00/hour positions, and finally 
>chose a position with a firm several blocks away from my wife, simply 
>because I only intended to stay there for a year before college.  While 
>I was at this firm, it was made clear to me by my co-workers that, if I 
>did not have a wife and family, I would likely go quite far.  Disgusted 
>by the whole experience, my wife and I decided to move back to North 
>Dakota so I could finish my degree.  She found her current position 
>immediately, rose quickly to Senior Consultant, but that is where she 
>will stay, as there is no more room for advancement, and there is no 
>economic opportunity in this part of the country.
>
>I tell this story because we were both stunned by the entire experience. 
> I was raised by three older sisters, so the concept of treating women 
>as anything other than competent human beings was (and is) beyond me.  
>While I was in the military, my wife was treated with nothing short of 
>the respect that should be expected by anyone.  Instead, we found the 
>Denver Metro area to be, by and large, a "Penis-Only" club, with the 
>women that were making it catering to the market by dressing 
>ridiculously. (Thigh-high slit skirts in a business meeting?  Please.)  
>Sexism, we discovered, does exist, and does not appear to be going away. 

Yes, sexism (and ageism, by the way) DOES indeed exist.  I like to
believe that in scattered places it IS going away, albeit very slowly.
Those such as yourself who have *personal* experience (as do I) with
this sort of thing, are at least aware of it.

> It horrifies me, it disgusts me, and it makes me shudder at the state 
>of humanity.  I am not after the "one thing" that the previous poster 
>implied, and do not tolerate any such treatment in my presence.  In the 
>year we have to seek out better economic opportunities I can only hope 
>that we will find a location that offers interviews based on 
>skills and not bust-size.  We're both tired of a business environment 
>where the chances of my wife being hired are directly proportionaly to 
>how high her skirt is.
>
>Tony Bruno

I hope for you and your wife's sake that you are both able to find
work in a location that is acceptable.  (By the way, I refuse to
wear skirts.)

Marg


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