🚀 go-pugleaf

In article <310D25C1.2086@plano.net>, jkim@plano.net says...

                        [STUFF DELETED]

>Please note that the problem I had w/ MICRON computer was not only the 
>Video card, but also the Motherboard itself.  It just failed 5 months
>after I bought it.  And I have found few others have the exact same
>symtoms.  Someone suggest that I might having problem w/ SIMM on my
>motherboard.  I havn't test that.
>
>I have Compaq DeskPro PCI/EISA at work, Gateway 2000 PCI/ISA & Micron 
>PCI/ISA at Home.  All three of them are Pentium 
>133Mhz.  The performance wise I like the Gateway 2000 best.  
>For the Customer Service, my previous computer was Gateway 
>and I was satisfied with their service.

                    [STUFF DELETED]

I would like to jump in at this point and talk about RELIABILITY,
and SERVICE. 

As a consumer I feel that one can save money in two ways, 
on the front end of a deal or on the back end. You can 
purchase a product for a low cost and take your chances 
or you can pay a premium price and forget about problems 
at a later date.

And most of us know Problems $$$ COST MONEY $$$

Lets say you had purchased the HP Netserver and for any 
reason it failed. A simple call to HP and your computer 
would be working that same day......SERVICE!

But with that same HP there is almost NO chance of the machine
doing the old death march... because HP has to SPEND MONEY to
service your machine, therefore they tend to manufacture with
QUALITY (and not luck)

What I'm attempting to say is that a lot of the companies
with the big glossy adds in computer shopper are selling
products that should be in a trash can and not on a desktop.
And I have also been burned! thinking if they can afford the
the big expensive ad they must be ok.... Ha Ha Ha

If you are betting your business it pay to go with QUALITY
and RELIABILITY. So what if you pay a few dollars more, you
always get your money back on the rear end of the deal. 

Now for a shameless advert. Come on over to the BYTE we carry 
only the BEST. IBM DEC COMPAQ HP NEC......... its worth it!

-- 
================================|
Collins White, Exec. Dir.       |
FIRST BYTE DATA SYSTEMS         |         Life "IS"
VOX:   713/855-6560             |         a   Sport
FAX:   713/855-0041             |
We Provide Solutions Today      |       DRINK IT UP !
   You Can Use Tomorrow         |   (SOME AD COPY WRITER)
    www.first-byte.com          |==========================

: If you are betting your business it pay to go with QUALITY
: and RELIABILITY. So what if you pay a few dollars more, you
: always get your money back on the rear end of the deal. 

Yah, yah.  Ten years ago I bought IBM PS/2s (Model 50 & 50z).  The
best when it first came out.  Through the years I've regretted that
decision.  I still keep one as a sculpture/work of art thing to 
remind me to never make generalizations.

You have hit the age old economic question...does higher price
indicate better product?  Just because a corporation charges a higher
price to the comsumer does not indicate that their product is better
or of higher quality.  Nor does it indicate better customer service.



cwhite@first-byte.com (Collins White) wrote:

>In article <310D25C1.2086@plano.net>, jkim@plano.net says...

>                        [STUFF DELETED]

>>Please note that the problem I had w/ MICRON computer was not only the 
>>Video card, but also the Motherboard itself.  It just failed 5 months
>>after I bought it.  And I have found few others have the exact same
>>symtoms.  Someone suggest that I might having problem w/ SIMM on my
>>motherboard.  I havn't test that.
>>
>>I have Compaq DeskPro PCI/EISA at work, Gateway 2000 PCI/ISA & Micron 
>>PCI/ISA at Home.  All three of them are Pentium 
>>133Mhz.  The performance wise I like the Gateway 2000 best.  
>>For the Customer Service, my previous computer was Gateway 
>>and I was satisfied with their service.

>                    [STUFF DELETED]

>I would like to jump in at this point and talk about RELIABILITY,
>and SERVICE. 

>As a consumer I feel that one can save money in two ways, 
>on the front end of a deal or on the back end. You can 
>purchase a product for a low cost and take your chances 
>or you can pay a premium price and forget about problems 
>at a later date.

>And most of us know Problems $$$ COST MONEY $$$

>Lets say you had purchased the HP Netserver and for any 
>reason it failed. A simple call to HP and your computer 
>would be working that same day......SERVICE!

>But with that same HP there is almost NO chance of the machine
>doing the old death march... because HP has to SPEND MONEY to
>service your machine, therefore they tend to manufacture with
>QUALITY (and not luck)

>What I'm attempting to say is that a lot of the companies
>with the big glossy adds in computer shopper are selling
>products that should be in a trash can and not on a desktop.
>And I have also been burned! thinking if they can afford the
>the big expensive ad they must be ok.... Ha Ha Ha

>If you are betting your business it pay to go with QUALITY
>and RELIABILITY. So what if you pay a few dollars more, you
>always get your money back on the rear end of the deal. 

>Now for a shameless advert. Come on over to the BYTE we carry 
>only the BEST. IBM DEC COMPAQ HP NEC......... its worth it!

>-- 
>================================|
>Collins White, Exec. Dir.       |
>FIRST BYTE DATA SYSTEMS         |         Life "IS"
>VOX:   713/855-6560             |         a   Sport
>FAX:   713/855-0041             |
>We Provide Solutions Today      |       DRINK IT UP !
>   You Can Use Tomorrow         |   (SOME AD COPY WRITER)
>    www.first-byte.com          |==========================


J. Scott Gardiner
jsgard@ix.netcom.com

"The most important political office is that of private citizen"		Louis Brandeis

I hear Seong-Yo bitchin' about Micron, but I know that my roommate and I 
own three Micron computers and they have not given us  any problems and 
we have been very happy with our purchase (even though my roommate now 
wants to buy a Mac).
As for cheaper part, Seong-Yo-do you know what Microns have and what 
Gateways have?? Microns uses Vibra 16's (Creative Labs) and Gateway uses 
Eqsonics-I guess that they didn't want to spend the extra cash to get 
Soundblaster.
As for customer service, as soon as I bought my computer and it was 
shipped to me, I broke off the monitor stand (because I didn't read the 
directions) and then I called Micron and they sent me a new one in two 
business days!!! My roommate and I also got money back because they 
dropped their prices within 30 days of our purchase-I got $200 back and 
my roommate got more-and he was the one bitchin' about Gateway's 
customer service!!!!!!

AMEN.

If taking care of the customer is important to you...Micron doesn't.

bob

On 1 Feb 1996 21:30:59 GMT, Bob Moister <BMOISTER@mci.newscorp.com> wrote:
|AMEN.
|
|If taking care of the customer is important to you...Micron doesn't.

As your statement stands it's meaningless, since taking care of a
customer can be done in any number of ways, and may be: none which
the customer likes.  One should differentiate a treat from a treatment.
My best experience has been with "Dell", and I starting buying PCs in
1982.

-- 
Louis-ljl-{LLaBash@eniac.ac.siue.edu | lou@minuet.siue.edu}

Hans Huang <huangh2@rpi.edu> wrote:

>As for cheaper part, Seong-Yo-do you know what Microns have and what 
>Gateways have?? Microns uses Vibra 16's (Creative Labs) and Gateway uses 
>Eqsonics-I guess that they didn't want to spend the extra cash to get 
>Soundblaster.

Just a quick reality check from a happy Gateway customer.  The Ensoniq wavetable card is a more
expensive and higher quality card than a SB16 clone.  

Simon Jester

cwhite@first-byte.com (Collins White) wrote:


>Now for a shameless advert. Come on over to the BYTE we carry 
>only the BEST. IBM DEC COMPAQ HP NEC......... its worth it!

DEC ain't in the business anymore, and COMPAQ has scrapped its 1-yr
onsite for a 90-day on-site. Oh, and yeah, COMPAQ charges $35 per
call.

>-- 
>================================|
>Collins White, Exec. Dir.       |
>FIRST BYTE DATA SYSTEMS         |         Life "IS"
>VOX:   713/855-6560             |         a   Sport
>FAX:   713/855-0041             |
>We Provide Solutions Today      |       DRINK IT UP !
>   You Can Use Tomorrow         |   (SOME AD COPY WRITER)
>    www.first-byte.com          |==========================

Hans Huang <huangh2@rpi.edu> wrote:

>I hear Seong-Yo bitchin' about Micron, but I know that my roommate and I 
>own three Micron computers and they have not given us  any problems and 
>we have been very happy with our purchase (even though my roommate now 
>wants to buy a Mac).
----- stuff snipped----------------------

Ditto the above. We have used Microns in our office for a long time.
We still have our first Micron 486 (back when the were called Edge
computers, says Edge on the case) must be at least 4 or 5 years old
and it's still banging out the numbers.

We resisted buying "name brands" (i.e., Compaq) because it seemed to
us the spare parts were way too expensive. I remember having to
replace a harddrive in an old Compaq 386 20e and it "had" to be a
Compaq drive that cost us about $800 for 120Mb (this was a couple of
years ago). If something fails on our Microns and they are off
warranty (which hasn't happened) or if we just want to upgrade the
drive  or something I can go down to the nearest computer hardware
store and pick up any drive I want.


 /**********************************************************\
| Dave Deeds (dldeeds@micron.net)                            |
|                                                            |
| Amiga 4000/40,BB386-25,CD-32,A1000                         |
| Owner and user of Amiga's since 1987                       |
\************************************************************/

Hans Huang wrote:
> [snip]
> As for customer service, as soon as I bought my computer and it was
> shipped to me, I broke off the monitor stand (because I didn't read the
> directions) and then I called Micron and they sent me a new one in two
> business days!!! My roommate and I also got money back because they
> dropped their prices within 30 days of our purchase-I got $200 back and
> my roommate got more-and he was the one bitchin' about Gateway's
> customer service!!!!!!

All of the things you mention are things that any big company is
prepared to handle.  If you break a monitor stand, then they send
a new one out.  If the price drops, they give you a refund (if
they offer this as practice).  I almost don't consider this customer
service, but rather following policy.  They are set up to handle 
these situations, and _usually_ they handle them well (or the 
computers do it for them anyway).  And, for all the people who 
have never had a problem with their computer, why shouldn't you 
be happy with it?  Don't say the company is great - say the 
computers are great.  Which they are...

Customer service comes into play when something doesn't fit into
the computer model.  Or the model fails...

How about if you talk to a tech support person, they tell you they
are sending out a part, and you never get it.  You call customer
service and it isn't on the computer.  Then they tell you to call
tech support again.  THAT ISN'T SERVICE!  They should take a name
and find the tech support person (first name, last initial) and
fix the situation with you, not throw you back in the tech support
queue to start over and re-explain.  - at least get a tech on the 
line for you.  I went through this 'transfer to tech support' loop
twice, and for some reason the computer still wasn't sending me 
the part.

When you call saying you didn't receive a package, "CUSTOMER SERVICE"
would call UPS and find out where it was, not give you a 20+ digit
tracking number and a phone number.

Another example, an address change.  After 6 different people 
including my Sales rep, Cust. Service, and e-mail (I count it 
separate because there is no room for confusion - it is 
spelled out on the screen), the address is almost correct.  My
sales rep scrambled information he pulled up from my business with
my personal computer order.  The business name is still on there,
but at least the address contains a street and number now.  Why is
my address a big deal?  Because all of the replacement parts go to
it!  And without an address UPS can't find me (since the ph. was
also wrong)  Everyone tells you it is changed, but nobody follows
through to see if it actually changed or whether their command
was ignored.

This is getting too long.  I think I've expressed MY opinion.
-Bill Spens
(spens@uoknor.edu)

Bill Spens wrote:
> 
> Hans Huang wrote:
> > [snip]
> > As for customer service, as soon as I bought my computer and it was
> > shipped to me, I broke off the monitor stand (because I didn't read the
> > directions) and then I called Micron and they sent me a new one in two
> > business days!!! My roommate and I also got money back because they
> > dropped their prices within 30 days of our purchase-I got $200 back and
> > my roommate got more-and he was the one bitchin' about Gateway's
> > customer service!!!!!!
> 
> All of the things you mention are things that any big company is
> prepared to handle.  If you break a monitor stand, then they send
> a new one out.  If the price drops, they give you a refund (if
> they offer this as practice).  I almost don't consider this customer
> service, but rather following policy.  They are set up to handle
> these situations, and _usually_ they handle them well (or the
> computers do it for them anyway).  And, for all the people who
> have never had a problem with their computer, why shouldn't you
> be happy with it?  Don't say the company is great - say the
> computers are great.  Which they are...
> 
> Customer service comes into play when something doesn't fit into
> the computer model.  Or the model fails...
> 
> How about if you talk to a tech support person, they tell you they
> are sending out a part, and you never get it.  You call customer
> service and it isn't on the computer.  Then they tell you to call
> tech support again.  THAT ISN'T SERVICE!  They should take a name
> and find the tech support person (first name, last initial) and
> fix the situation with you, not throw you back in the tech support
> queue to start over and re-explain.  - at least get a tech on the
> line for you.  I went through this 'transfer to tech support' loop
> twice, and for some reason the computer still wasn't sending me
> the part.
> 
> When you call saying you didn't receive a package, "CUSTOMER SERVICE"
> would call UPS and find out where it was, not give you a 20+ digit
> tracking number and a phone number.
> 
> Another example, an address change.  After 6 different people
> including my Sales rep, Cust. Service, and e-mail (I count it
> separate because there is no room for confusion - it is
> spelled out on the screen), the address is almost correct.  My
> sales rep scrambled information he pulled up from my business with
> my personal computer order.  The business name is still on there,
> but at least the address contains a street and number now.  Why is
> my address a big deal?  Because all of the replacement parts go to
> it!  And without an address UPS can't find me (since the ph. was
> also wrong)  Everyone tells you it is changed, but nobody follows
> through to see if it actually changed or whether their command
> was ignored.
> 
> This is getting too long.  I think I've expressed MY opinion.
> -Bill Spens
> (spens@uoknor.edu)

I bought a Micron P133 Millennia in late December.  I had a DOA modem 
and some other problems.  Micron Techs did help me solve my problems and 
my replacement modem came in 2 days.  I also took advantage of the price 
reduction.  In general I am happy with the sales and service departments 
at Micron.  I am very happy with my system.

John Spencer
jrs@fc.hp.com

Well, I have bought 3 machines from Micron recently

 1) P133 - no problem, well, other than it arrived set to 110V, which we
    just noticed in time.

 2) Powerserver (2x P133).   Aveter delays and delays again, the machine
    finally arrived slightly damaged (broken pins on the backplane), which
    was replacedpromptly.

 3) P150. Arrived on time, again with a damaged backplane, and a totally
    incorrect configuration - 16M RAM instead of 32, wrong soundcard, 
    a missing CD-ROM, etc.  Now, more than a week later, they still have
    not responded to my repeated phone calls or faxes.

I guess I will be buying from Dell in the future.

-frisk

-- 
Fridrik Skulason      Frisk Software International     phone: +354-5-617273
Author of F-PROT      E-mail: frisk@complex.is         fax:   +354-5-617274

Just want to say thanks for reviews on Micron...Helped me make my choice 
alot easier...

ssc@pop3.tiac.net (Stephen St.Clair) wrote:

>cwhite@first-byte.com (Collins White) wrote:


>>Now for a shameless advert. Come on over to the BYTE we carry 
>>only the BEST. IBM DEC COMPAQ HP NEC......... its worth it!

>DEC ain't in the business anymore, and COMPAQ has scrapped its 1-yr
>onsite for a 90-day on-site. Oh, and yeah, COMPAQ charges $35 per
>call.

DEC ain't in the business anymore? What are you talking about? 
--
                                 Seth Jackson

Seth Jackson's Songwriting Page: http://www.cinenet.net/users/speaker
The Online Home of "Country Notes" for the Los Angeles area 

Seth Jackson wrote:
> 
> ssc@pop3.tiac.net (Stephen St.Clair) wrote:
> 
> >cwhite@first-byte.com (Collins White) wrote:
> 
> >>Now for a shameless advert. Come on over to the BYTE we carry
> >>only the BEST. IBM DEC COMPAQ HP NEC......... its worth it!
> 
> >DEC ain't in the business anymore, and COMPAQ has scrapped its 1-yr
> >onsite for a 90-day on-site. Oh, and yeah, COMPAQ charges $35 per
> >call.
> 
> DEC ain't in the business anymore? What are you talking about?
> --
>                                  Seth Jackson
> 
> Seth Jackson's Songwriting Page: http://www.cinenet.net/users/speaker
> The Online Home of "Country Notes" for the Los Angeles area

DEC announced they were out of the desktop business a couple of days 
ago.

NEC bought Packard Bell and Zenith.

The list shrinks.

In article <31115B44.7006@rpi.edu>, huangh2@rpi.edu says...

>As for cheaper part, Seong-Yo-do you know what Microns have and what 
>Gateways have?? Microns uses Vibra 16's (Creative Labs) and Gateway uses 
>Eqsonics-I guess that they didn't want to spend the extra cash to get 
>Soundblaster.

Well, the Vibra 16 is on the bottom rung of both sound quality and price, the
Ensoniq card is superior in both regards.  The Vibra is just a Soundblaster
16 lacking tone controls, eh?  The Ensoniq Soundscape costs nearly twice
as much.  So, I don't see your point.

from following this thread, i'd say your experience is atypical.
hopefully Micron has contacted you and resolved your problem

since we're more apt to hear about complaints than compliments, as a
counterpoint, i'd like to say i'm happy with micron, i've had my
system for 9 weeks now no problems.  contacted my sales rep twice, he
responded quickly via email & voice.

i would expect the same level of SERVICE (as somebody stated in this
thread) from DELL or HP.  as for quality, the components look pretty
good.

good luck.

dan


Seong-Yong Kim <jkim@plano.net> wrote:

>Ronny H Angkasa wrote:
>> 
>> i felt sorry to hear about your experience and horrified too.
>> 
>> besides the video card and poor customer service, did you have or have
>> you ever had any kind of problem with the hard drive, ram, etc.?
>> 
>> currently i am planning to get a desktop and have narrowed down my
>> alternatives between hp pavillion, dell dimension and micron millenia
>> (all 166 mhz pentium). again, thanks for sharing with us your experience.
>> --
>> Ronny Angkasa
>> 
>> email address : rhast4@pitt.edu
>>                 http://www.pitt.edu/~rhast4/index.html


>Please note that the problem I had w/ MICRON computer was not only the Video card, but also the Motherboard itself.  It 
>just failed 5 months after I bought it.  And I have found few others have the exact same symtoms.  Someone suggest that I 
>might having problem w/ SIMM on my motherboard.  I havn't test that.

>I have Compaq DeskPro PCI/EISA at work, Gateway 2000 PCI/ISA & Micron PCI/ISA at Home.  All three of them are Pentium 
>133Mhz.  The performance wise I like the Gateway 2000 best.  For the Customer Service, my previous computer was Gateway 
>and I was satisfied with their service.

>Only the downside for me was that I had to pay the TAX for Gateway, while I don't do that for Micron.  But It would've 
>been worth to pay that extra $400.  With Gateway 2000 I got what I expected.  With Micron I got cheaper version of 
>everything I expected to get w/ failing motherboard and Wait-me-forever-I-don't-give-a-damn Customer Service.  After I 
>have gone through all this trouble, they told me that they are trying to improve their service, and are going to send 
>send me another motherboard, and are going to extend my warranty another 3 months.

>At this point, all I want is that get my money back, and buy me an another Gateway 2000.  But Micron wouldn't do give my 
>money back.  So I guess I am still where I was three weeks ago staring at the dead Micron computer which is (WAS suppose 
>to be) my server machine.

>I hope you have better luck than I am.

Mike Focke wrote:
>> DEC announced they were out of the desktop business a couple of days ago.

Correction: DEC announced that it has dropped out of the
CONSUMER desktop business.  (Apparently, they've decided to
focus on their core customer base: large companies.)

schmiric@sound.net (Simon Jester) wrote:

>Hans Huang <huangh2@rpi.edu> wrote:

>>As for cheaper part, Seong-Yo-do you know what Microns have and what 
>>Gateways have?? Microns uses Vibra 16's (Creative Labs) and Gateway uses 
>>Eqsonics-I guess that they didn't want to spend the extra cash to get 
>>Soundblaster.

>Just a quick reality check from a happy Gateway customer.  The Ensoniq wavetable card is a more
>expensive and higher quality card than a SB16 clone.  

>Simon Jester

Ensonics are more expensive,  but Micron uses genuine Sound Blasters,
not a clone.

Carl Rohman wrote:
> 
> schmiric@sound.net (Simon Jester) wrote:
> 
> >Hans Huang <huangh2@rpi.edu> wrote:
> 
> >>As for cheaper part, Seong-Yo-do you know what Microns have and what
> >>Gateways have?? Microns uses Vibra 16's (Creative Labs) and Gateway uses
> >>Eqsonics-I guess that they didn't want to spend the extra cash to get
> >>Soundblaster.
> 
> >Just a quick reality check from a happy Gateway customer.  The Ensoniq wavetable card is a more
> >expensive and higher quality card than a SB16 clone.
> 
> >Simon Jester
> 
> Ensonics are more expensive,  but Micron uses genuine Sound Blasters,
> not a clone.

Who cares if it is a clone.  I own both, and the Ensoniq card KICKS SB's ass in sound.
The only comparible thing is that Ensoniq was cool enough to make the card completely
emulate the SB w/out software drivers.  

They made a diamond that looked, felt, and smelled like a turd for those who are unable to 
see diamonds.

-j

Sir Joseph of Greenwood <greendot@laplaza.taos.nm.us> wrote:

>Carl Rohman wrote:
>> 
>
>> Ensonics are more expensive,  but Micron uses genuine Sound Blasters,
>> not a clone.

>Who cares if it is a clone.  I own both, and the Ensoniq card KICKS SB's ass in sound.
>The only comparible thing is that Ensoniq was cool enough to make the card completely
>emulate the SB w/out software drivers.  

Besides, one would hardly call the Ensoniq a clone. Ensoniq is a
leading manufacturer of professional MIDI synthesizers, and their
entree into the world of PC sound cards raises the level of what one
should expect from a mid-priced sound card. 

Calling the Ensoniq a clone of a Sound Blaster is like calling Godiva
chocolates a clone of Hershey's kisses.
--
                                 Seth Jackson

Seth Jackson's Songwriting Page: http://www.cinenet.net/users/speaker
The Online Home of "Country Notes" for the Los Angeles area 

FYI:  Gateway sells a Soundblaster 16 card manufactured 
by Creative Labs.  This was always the case but they 
have only recently been allowed to sell this as a 
soundblaster due to legal issues.  Call a salesperson 
and check.