🚀 go-pugleaf

Bogus User wrote:
> 
> CRITICAL MASS COMES TO SAN DIEGO!
> 
> Critical Mass Rides are happening across the planet to promote clean,
> affordable transportation and to demand an intelligent, healthy, and
> sustainable approach to transit & development.

What are you going to do, block traffic, kick car doors, and yell obscenities 
at those who can't get out of your way in time???

> 
> Critical Mass is a movement to promote bicycling and other self-propelled
> transportation, as an alternative to the appalling inhumanity of
> automobile-dominated culture.  Riders meet at one or more agreed on
> locations and ride together en masse once a month.
> 

Have you ever considerd that biking to work may be IMPRACTICAL for some of us???

On Sun, 30 Nov 1997 22:36:49 -0800, Stan Rothwell
<rothwell@ix.netcom.com> wrote:

.Bogus User wrote:
.> 
.> CRITICAL MASS COMES TO SAN DIEGO!
.> 
.> Critical Mass Rides are happening across the planet to promote clean,
.> affordable transportation and to demand an intelligent, healthy, and
.> sustainable approach to transit & development.
.
.What are you going to do, block traffic, kick car doors, and yell obscenities 
.at those who can't get out of your way in time???
.
.> 
.> Critical Mass is a movement to promote bicycling and other self-propelled
.> transportation, as an alternative to the appalling inhumanity of
.> automobile-dominated culture.  Riders meet at one or more agreed on
.> locations and ride together en masse once a month.
.> 
.
.Have you ever considerd that biking to work may be IMPRACTICAL for some of us???

Why? Usually because you CHOOSE to live or work where biking is
impractical. You can't expect to live in the suburbs and be well
served by transit or biking.
---
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8 years
fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

http://www.imaja.com/change/environment/mvarticles

> .> Critical Mass is a movement to promote bicycling and other self-propelled
> .> transportation

> .Have you ever considerd that biking to work may be IMPRACTICAL for some of us???
> 
> Why? Usually because you CHOOSE to live or work where biking is
> impractical. You can't expect to live in the suburbs and be well
> served by transit or biking.

Why not?  

What I would love to see is a news article about a married couple, WITH KIDS,
that has no car, and uses bicycles and other wonderful forms of transportation.
You know, father biking off to sorrento valley to work, mom biking to somewhere
else, kids riding the school bus, etc.
All I ever see are college students or older guys trying to stay in shape by
biking to work (whose kids are off to college), etc.
It's simply impractical for someone with kids to shop for groceries on bikes
with a duck trail of grade-schoolers tagging behind.

What are you going to do if a kid needs a trip to the hospital, bike down?
Wait an hour for a cab?  Wait two hours for a bus?

To those who have a lifestyle that enables them to use self-propelled modes
of transport, good for you, more power to you.
Some day maybe I'll be in that group, but not now, and I will feel absolutely
NO guilt about driving my car.

-- 
Joe St. Lucas, jstlucas@znet.com, http://sd.znet.com/~jstlucas
Work is something to keep me busy between ultimate frisbee games.
Currently researching surnames SANTOLUCA, ANZALDO

On Thu, 04 Dec 1997 19:58:06 -0800, "Joe St. Lucas"
<jstlucas@znet.com> wrote:

.> .> Critical Mass is a movement to promote bicycling and other self-propelled
.> .> transportation
.
.> .Have you ever considerd that biking to work may be IMPRACTICAL for some of us???
.> 
.> Why? Usually because you CHOOSE to live or work where biking is
.> impractical. You can't expect to live in the suburbs and be well
.> served by transit or biking.
.
.Why not?  
.
.What I would love to see is a news article about a married couple, WITH KIDS,
.that has no car, and uses bicycles and other wonderful forms of transportation.
.You know, father biking off to sorrento valley to work, mom biking to somewhere
.else, kids riding the school bus, etc.
.All I ever see are college students or older guys trying to stay in shape by
.biking to work (whose kids are off to college), etc.
.It's simply impractical for someone with kids to shop for groceries on bikes
.with a duck trail of grade-schoolers tagging behind.
.
.What are you going to do if a kid needs a trip to the hospital, bike down?

Yes, and probably get there faster than today's car traffic.

.Wait an hour for a cab? 

Now you are lying. It doesn't take an hour to get a cab, if you live
in the city, and not on top of a mountain.

 Wait two hours for a bus?

It never takes 2 hours to get a bus, unless you live on top of a
mountain. The point is that you can choose to live where transit is
convenient. If you choose otherwise, then it is your problem, not
ours.

.To those who have a lifestyle that enables them to use self-propelled modes
.of transport, good for you, more power to you.
.Some day maybe I'll be in that group, but not now, and I will feel absolutely
.NO guilt about driving my car.

You should. You have deliberately chosen a car-dependent lifestyle.

.Joe St. Lucas, jstlucas@znet.com, http://sd.znet.com/~jstlucas
.Work is something to keep me busy between ultimate frisbee games.
.Currently researching surnames SANTOLUCA, ANZALDO

---
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8 years
fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

http://www.imaja.com/change/environment/mvarticles

Mike Vandeman wrote:

 > On Thu, 04 Dec 1997 19:58:06 -0800, "Joe St. Lucas"
 > <jstlucas@znet.com> wrote:
 
 > .> .> Critical Mass is a movement to promote bicycling
 > .> .> and other self-propelled transportation


Not true, in SF last summer cyclists made asses of themselves. Their
arrogance caused this movement a huge set back. So much so, even duh
Mayor who typically endorses eco- nazism did an about face on the
movement. 


 > .> .Have you ever considerd that biking to work may be 
 > .> IMPRACTICAL for some of us???

 > .> Why? Usually because you CHOOSE to live or work where 
 > .> biking is impractical. You can't expect to live in the 
 > .> suburbs and be well served by transit or biking.


Really... not for everyone. This statement makes a grand assumption, and
does not take under consideration most areas of California. Tis true for
for SF (the second logic free zone in the US) and now maybe in San
Diego.. we'll see though.


 > .Why not?

 > .What I would love to see is a news article about a married 
 > .couple, WITH KIDS,that has no car, and uses bicycles and 
 > .other wonderful forms of transportation. You know, father 
 > .biking off to sorrento valley to work, mom biking to somewhere
 > .else, kids riding the school bus, etc. All I ever see are 
 > .college students or older guys trying to stay in shape by
 > .biking to work (whose kids are off to college), etc.
 > .It's simply impractical for someone with kids to shop for 
 > .groceries on bikes with a duck trail of grade-schoolers tagging 
 > .behind.

 > .What are you going to do if a kid needs a trip to the hospital, 
 > .bike down?

 > Yes, and probably get there faster than today's car traffic.


Another grand assumption...
 
 
 > .Wait an hour for a cab?
 
 > Now you are lying. It doesn't take an hour to
 > get a cab, if you live in the city, and not on 
 > top of a mountain.


Probably not an hour, but you totally dismiss the impraticality of day
to day living in many locals without a vehicle. For this generation,
most were born into motorized transportion and into areas where it is
absolutely essential, and that's not going to cease easily (although
some ecos would like to dictate where people could live too). Enormous
transportation alternative projects need to be completed, for one, until
this problem can even begin to be reversed.


 >  Wait two hours for a bus?
 
 > It never takes 2 hours to get a bus, unless 
 > you live on top of a mountain. The point is 
 > that you can choose to live where transit is
 > convenient. If you choose otherwise, then it 
 > is your problem, not ours.

This is because Ecos have made it others' problems.

 
 > .To those who have a lifestyle that enables them to 
 > .use self-propelled modes of transport, good for you, 
 > .more power to you. Some day maybe I'll be in that 
 > .group, but not now, and I will feel absolutely
 > .NO guilt about driving my car.

 > You should. You have deliberately chosen a car-dependent lifestyle.


No one need feel guilty for being born into the world they now live, and
this contention is ludicrous. The reason Eco-nuts push this agenda, is
because they want to prescribe their wonderous idealism on everyone
else, whether feasible or not.

I'm happy to see, at least some honesty in this whole argument of--- To
have Cars or Not. Ecos want cars taken em away from everyone, justified
or not.

LN

The only 'massholes' or *ssholes around here are the idiots who drive
two blocks to buy a tube of toothpaste in their gas guzzling SUV or
drive to work even though a bus (or better yet a bike) will get them
their in almost the same amount of time.  One of the points of Critical
Mass is to change this lazy and polluting behavior.  If it
inconveniences a few motorists, so be it...No, not everyone can bike or
bus to their jobs, but I bet with just a little sacrafice (something
most in this gas-guzzling economy couldn't handle) most could at least
try alternative transportation once in awhile.

I keep waiting for the day for gas prices to rise to $10/gallon...

>that has no car, and uses bicycles and other wonderful forms of transportation.
>You know, father biking off to sorrento valley to work, mom biking to somewhere
>else, kids riding the school bus, etc.

I believe the original poster simply advocated biking to work.	I don't
see why, if you live close enough, you can't bike to work whether you're
a father or no.  I suppose if you take the kids to school you couldn't do
it, but if you trade that duty with your wife you could certainly bike on
your off days.

I can't imagine a scenario under which a physically healthy person could
not make at least some short trips on foot or by bike.	What a bunch of
lazy selfish jerks we've all become.

>What are you going to do if a kid needs a trip to the hospital, bike down?
>Wait an hour for a cab?  Wait two hours for a bus?

I presume you would take the car.  And I presume you would have the
decency to choose a fuel efficient one rather than a range rover.  My mom
did just fine with a Vega station wagon when I was growing up.	No one
*needs* a yuppy- van.


ciao,
John

-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet

This person needs to take a political science class.  He aparently doesn't
understand the political power of the big three, and he doesn't understand
the influence that the government has in our types of transportation.

>I'm happy to see, at least some honesty in this whole argument of--- To
>have Cars or Not. Ecos want cars taken em away from everyone, justified
>or not.
>

Cars taken away from everyone?  You mean I would be able to breath fresh air
in San Jose?  That sounds like a dream come true!  I think I like Ecos!  :)

>The only 'massholes' or *ssholes around here are the idiots who drive
>two blocks to buy a tube of toothpaste in their gas guzzling SUV or
>drive to work even though a bus (or better yet a bike) will get them
>their in almost the same amount of time.  One of the points of Critical
>Mass is to change this lazy and polluting behavior.  If it
>inconveniences a few motorists, so be it...No, not everyone can bike or
>bus to their jobs, but I bet with just a little sacrafice (something
>most in this gas-guzzling economy couldn't handle) most could at least
>try alternative transportation once in awhile.
>
>I keep waiting for the day for gas prices to rise to $10/gallon...

Me too.  They raised them in Europe and everyone is happy, so they can raise
them here and everyone will still be happy.

Unfortunately, a great majority of the US population is sinning by driving 3
miles or less to work every day, which is a leading cause for global
warming, and who knows what else...  How can one make the US more like
leading countries such as China, Germany, and Japan, where less people use
their cars?  How can one tell millions of people that they are ignorant and
lazy in a nice way, for the benefit of their children???  Every day I hear
complaints of how difficult it is to ride a bike or take a bus.  I've been
bicycling ever since I had my own bike, and I've never stopped loving the
sport.  People won't ride their bicycles because they are lazy, unwilling to
change, and unwilling to make small sacrifices, and afraid of things that
they hear in the media.  Unfortunately, as one of the few citizens who
really loves this country enough to make an extra effort to help it, I think
that the best thing for me is to leave it so that I can live happily.  There
are too many uncaring people, and it'll take too long to change them.

Dani Kuettel wrote:
 > I think that the best thing for me is to 
 > leave it so that I can live happily.  There
 > are too many uncaring people, and it'll take 
 > too long to change them.

 So why don't you try China first where you think you'll be so happy,
but don't bother asking the Chinese why they so vehemently want to come
to the good ole USA...

LN

Dani Kuettel wrote in message <66aimi$7e4$2@news.ncal.verio.com>...
>>I keep waiting for the day for gas prices to rise to $10/gallon...
>
>Me too.  They raised them in Europe and everyone is happy, so they can
raise them here and everyone will still be happy.
>
>Unfortunately, a great majority of the US population is sinning by driving
3 miles or less to work every day, which is a leading cause for global
>warming, and who knows what else...  How can one make the US more like
leading countries such as China, Germany, and Japan, where less people use
their cars?

What is the PROOF that driving 3 miles is a "leading cause for global
warming"?  Where is your PROOF that there is ANY global warming?
What makes China a "leading" country? How about Germany and Japan?
What specifically is it about China that is so better than the US that we
NEED to emulate?  How many times have you been to China?  How many protests
against the government have you participated in China?

Mike Vandeman wrote:

>  Wait two hours for a bus?
> 
> It never takes 2 hours to get a bus,

But, it does take 2 hours *to get somewhere* once on said bus.

> unless you live on top of a mountain. The point is that you can
> choose to live where transit is convenient. If you choose 
> otherwise, then it is your problem, not ours.

Hsan't he solved his "problem" by owning a car?

> .To those who have a lifestyle that enables them to use 
> self-propelled modes of transport, good for you, more power to you.
> Some day maybe I'll be in that group, but not now, and I will feel 
> absolutely NO guilt about driving my car.
> 
> You should. You have deliberately chosen a car-dependent lifestyle.
	             ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
D'oh!  I do believe in the idea that people make their own lives, but 
this can only happen to a certain extent.  How do you know this person 
can well afford to move to a mass-transit friendly area?  Perhaps he 
cannot even if he wanted to, and thus he lives here.  Let's say he has 
three young babies; seems a little impractical to me to be toting the 
kids on a bicycle as one runs errands across the city.  I'd be 
interested in knowing what products you buy, or do you make all your 
own household products (i.e. dishwashing liquid, soap, etc.).  
Corporations do their fair share of polluting the environment, so I 
hope you're boycotting just about everything sold at your neighborhood 
Lucky.  Like was said earlier, if you can do the bicycle thing, 
great--I'm really almost jealous of you.  I can't bike to sdsu on my 
lunch break at work because I wouldn't have time.  I can drive there, 
though, and get back without being late and docked pay and all that.  
Most sdsu offices are open--for your convenience--during regular 
business hours.  And, as someone who is completing graduate school 
applications, I end up needing to go there a lot.  And I have yet to 
figure out how to get my dry cleaning home from the cleaners on a 
bike.  I'm sure there's a way, I just don't have enough ingenuity--or 
ambition, or both--for the task.

--sarah

Dani Kuettel wrote:

> Me too.  They raised them in Europe and everyone is happy, so they 
> can raise them here and everyone will still be happy.

Thanks for speaking for all of us, Dani!  Guess what--I am required to 
have my own car for the work that I do because of all the off-site 
wheelings and dealings I have to take care of.  My work does not pay 
for the gas I use.  So I am not happy about increases in gas prices.  
Fortunately, I'm about to change jobs.  I am lucky to have a degree 
and the opportunities that I have that allow me more freedom to decide 
what I want to do with the rest of my life.  At the same time, I 
remain acutely aware of the fact that there are thousands of other 
people who are not in the position to leave whatever job they have in 
pursuit of something they'd rather do.  So Dani, when gas prices 
increase yet again, will you be around to cheer up all those people 
who do have jobs where they use their car to do whatever needs to be 
done for whatever position they hold?  I sure hope so honey, 'cause 
there's a whole lot more of them than you can guess.

> Unfortunately, a great majority of the US population is sinning by 
> driving 3 miles or less to work every day, which is a leading cause
> for global warming, and who knows what else...  How can one make the
> US more like leading countries such as China, Germany, and Japan, 
> where less people use their cars?  

Germany and China--not exactly countries well known for their freedom.

I go to L.A. a lot on the weekends to see bands and to be with 
friends.  I do not have time (get off work late in the evening) to 
bike there.  If I need to be there at 8:30, a car is just the best 
way.  The train takes forever, and I certainly couldn't afford to take 
the train all the time.  

> How can one tell millions of people that they are ignorant and
> lazy in a nice way, for the benefit of their children???  Every day
> I hear complaints of how difficult it is to ride a bike or take a 
> bus.  I've been bicycling ever since I had my own bike, and I've 
> never stopped loving the sport. 

We're all very happy for you, Dani.  

> People won't ride their bicycles because they are lazy, unwilling to
> change, and unwilling to make small sacrifices, 

I have a friend who had a stroke at age two which left her less able 
to use the left side of her body.  Biking, for her, is extremely 
difficult.  I'll be sure to let her know tomorrow how lazy and 
unwilling to change she is.  

Please don't get so didactic, Dani.  It doesn't help your cause.

> and afraid of things that they hear in the media.  Unfortunately, as
> one of the few citizens who really loves this country enough to make
> an extra effort to help it, 

My god--I never believed before, but it looks like we have a saint on 
our hands!  Just because the country as a whole is not biking up a 
storm does not mean the majority of us counldn't give a rat's ass what 
happens to it.  We all have only so much time in a day, and there are 
a lot of causes out there.  Some rally for welfare reform, some for 
education, some for bicycling.  I had no idea that since I don't bike 
to work that I don't give a shit about this country.  Boy is my face 
red!

> I think that the best thing for me is to leave it so that I can live
> happily.  There are too many uncaring people, and it'll take too 
> long to change them.

Human nature is human nature.  I hadn't realized Utopia was out there. 
What the hell am I doing here when Eden is just a few short steps 
away!?  Will you biking to your new locale, or flying?  'Cause ya 
know, them airplanes do some pollutin' too.  I'm not sure where it is 
you're going to live that all its citizens live harmoniously, agreeing 
on each piece of legislation passed.  People in the U.S. are not the 
only breed resistant to change.  

--sarah

"Thank you for telling me the top-rented video.
But what does Robert Hilburn know about rock and roll?"

--TNP, "Birdcage"

pooh_@hotmail.com wrote:

> I believe the original poster simply advocated biking to work.  I 
> don't see why, if you live close enough, you can't bike to work 
> whether you're a father or no.

What--and breathe in all that polloution?  Pfffft--forget that!

> I suppose if you take the kids to school you couldn't do
> it, but if you trade that duty with your wife you could certainly 
> bike on your off days.

Here I would just like to admit to having a HUGE aversion to waking up 
early.  As it is, I wake up at 5:30.  If I biked to work, I'd have to 
get up at four, and I'd have to bathe in our sink at the office.  

> I can't imagine a scenario under which a physically healthy person 
> could not make at least some short trips on foot or by bike. 
> What a bunch of lazy selfish jerks we've all become.

I blame it on the invention of the romte control.

(You know what's sad is that our first remote control is actually a 
part of family lore.  It was pretty cool, though--three buttons: 
channel up--no down choice here

"Damn--I passed channel ten.  *Sigh* gotta go around again.  [click, 
click, click, pause]  Damn!"

...one on and off button and one mute I believe.  I think volume you 
had to do on the set.  Either that or the on and off was only on the 
set.  Either way, the thing had these three buttons (one pink, one a 
pastel orangey color, and one off-white).  My god--I've blabbed on an 
on about our first remote control!  I'm terribly ashamed...
> >What are you going to do if a kid needs a trip to the hospital, 
> > bike down?
> >Wait an hour for a cab?  Wait two hours for a bus?
> 
> I presume you would take the car. 

Is ANYONE gonna mention 911 or what?

> And I presume you would have the decency to choose a fuel efficient 
> one rather than a range rover.  

The Gremlin's good for another 10 years, dammit!

Funny story: My brother flew in for Thanksgiving last weekend.  At the 
airport, an announcement was made that the owner of a pink Pinto (I 
know, I know) would have to move their car because it was illegally 
parked (perhaps they were trying to abandon it?).  Anyway, this 
Southwest employee gets on the p.a. and goes, "We're not gonna ticket 
it, we're not gonna tow it, it's just plain tacky."

> My mom did just fine with a Vega station wagon when I was growing
> up.  

"Back in MY day..."

> No one *needs* a yuppy- van.

But John, car phones just don't look as good without the matching van.  

--sarah "back in my day we didn't have these fancy-shmancy *numbered* 
remote controls.  we had 3 buttons, and that's the way it was and we 
liked it!" fidelibus

>  So why don't you try China first where you think you'll be so happy,
> but don't bother asking the Chinese why they so vehemently want to come
> to the good ole USA...

Probably so they can dodge the restrictions on how much than can overbreed as
your family seems to have done.

>Thanks for speaking for all of us, Dani!  Guess what--I am required to
>have my own car for the work that I do because of all the off-site
>wheelings and dealings I have to take care of.  My work does not pay
>for the gas I use.  So I am not happy about increases in gas prices.
>Fortunately, I'm about to change jobs.  I am lucky to have a degree
>and the opportunities that I have that allow me more freedom to decide
>what I want to do with the rest of my life.  At the same time, I
>remain acutely aware of the fact that there are thousands of other
>people who are not in the position to leave whatever job they have in
>pursuit of something they'd rather do.  So Dani, when gas prices
>increase yet again, will you be around to cheer up all those people
>who do have jobs where they use their car to do whatever needs to be
>done for whatever position they hold?  I sure hope so honey, 'cause
>there's a whole lot more of them than you can guess.
>
>> Unfortunately, a great majority of the US population is sinning by
>> driving 3 miles or less to work every day, which is a leading cause
>> for global warming, and who knows what else...  How can one make the
>> US more like leading countries such as China, Germany, and Japan,
>> where less people use their cars?
>
>I go to L.A. a lot on the weekends to see bands and to be with
>friends.  I do not have time (get off work late in the evening) to
>bike there.  If I need to be there at 8:30, a car is just the best
>way.  The train takes forever, and I certainly couldn't afford to take
>the train all the time.
>
>> How can one tell millions of people that they are ignorant and
>> lazy in a nice way, for the benefit of their children???  Every day
>> I hear complaints of how difficult it is to ride a bike or take a
>> bus.  I've been bicycling ever since I had my own bike, and I've
>> never stopped loving the sport.
>
>We're all very happy for you, Dani.
>
>> People won't ride their bicycles because they are lazy, unwilling to
>> change, and unwilling to make small sacrifices,
>
>I have a friend who had a stroke at age two which left her less able
>to use the left side of her body.  Biking, for her, is extremely
>difficult.  I'll be sure to let her know tomorrow how lazy and
>unwilling to change she is.
>
>Please don't get so didactic, Dani.  It doesn't help your cause.
>
>> and afraid of things that they hear in the media.  Unfortunately, as
>> one of the few citizens who really loves this country enough to make
>> an extra effort to help it,
>
>My god--I never believed before, but it looks like we have a saint on
>our hands!  Just because the country as a whole is not biking up a
>storm does not mean the majority of us counldn't give a rat's ass what
>happens to it.  We all have only so much time in a day, and there are
>a lot of causes out there.  Some rally for welfare reform, some for
>education, some for bicycling.  I had no idea that since I don't bike
>to work that I don't give a shit about this country.  Boy is my face
>red!
>
>> I think that the best thing for me is to leave it so that I can live
>> happily.  There are too many uncaring people, and it'll take too
>> long to change them.
>
>Human nature is human nature.  I hadn't realized Utopia was out there.
>What the hell am I doing here when Eden is just a few short steps
>away!?  Will you biking to your new locale, or flying?  'Cause ya
>know, them airplanes do some pollutin' too.  I'm not sure where it is
>you're going to live that all its citizens live harmoniously, agreeing
>on each piece of legislation passed.  People in the U.S. are not the
>only breed resistant to change.

Dear friend,
Either I worded my last note wrong, or you are very biased against people
who enjoy riding their bicycles.  I used my own bicycling experience as an
example of how one can get around without a car.  Yet, I never said that
everyone should sell their cars and buy bicycles.  That would be absurd.
The whole concept that I was aiming at was to limit the usage of
automobiles.  I was trying to say that one should try to use a car only when
it is really necessary.  Driving alone three miles to work 5 times a week,
or driving around the block to the store, or to a friends house is
completely unnecessary, and destructive.   We have buses, trains, bicycles,
feet, wheelchairs, taxis, shuttles, trolleys, subways, and even people who
will give you a ride to work in a commute.  We have so many different
options in getting around, but most people ignorantly stick with their cars.
In other words, try to take the bus a few times a week, ask your friends to
go on the bus, make usage of your feet, ride your bike around a little, go
get a train schedule, or do anything possible to help get the message around
that a car is not a necessity.
As for your work, that's a whole different topic.
>Germany and China--not exactly countries well known for their freedom.
As a kid, I felt much more freedom living in Germany than I did in the U.S.
Freedom is nothing more than an idea.
At least in China people don't have to worry about not having the money to
buy justice, or not being able to afford a good lawyer.  How many African
Americans were imprisoned because they couldn't afford a good lawyer?  With
about 2 million people in our jails, more than any country in the world, our
people are very "free"!

> So why don't you try China first where you think you'll be so happy,
Well, I've been thinking about living there for a few years for quite some
time.  I think that it would be very exciting and interesting.  One thing
that one should never forget is that every country has something good and
something bad in it.  I have to admit that I haven't been there yet, but I'm
not going to believe the common US idea that China is such a bad place.
Have you been there before?  Probably not.
>but don't bother asking the Chinese why they so vehemently want to come
>to the good ole USA...

Are you trying to say that 1.2 billion people living in china want to move
to the US to live in congested areas like LA?  I'm sure that millions of
people in China are fairly happy with where they are.

Dani Kuettel wrote in message <66lhlp$r1q$1@news.ncal.verio.com>...

>At least in China people don't have to worry about not having the money to
>buy justice, or not being able to afford a good lawyer.  How many African
>Americans were imprisoned because they couldn't afford a good lawyer?  With
>about 2 million people in our jails, more than any country in the world,
our
>people are very "free"!
>
>
How many times have you been to China?

In article <34825B01.678B@ix.netcom.com>, rothwell@ix.netcom.com says...
> Have you ever considerd that biking to work may be IMPRACTICAL for some of us???

Why do you live so far from work that it is IMPRACTICAL? Why not live 
closer? Then, you COULD ride that bike. Hmm.

If I'm elected president:

No tax benefit for having children. Government should stay out of the 
procreation business!

Instead ...

I propose a system where tax deductions are allowed based solely on the 
distance a person lives from the place they are employed.

For example:

Less than 5 miles from work: Maximum tax benefit
5 - 9 miles from work: Medium tax benefit
10 or more miles from work: No tax benefit

Frankly, I'm surprised the citizens of this country have allowed our 
highway system to exist in its current form for so long.

--Tim
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Remove "nospam" to reply.
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In article <MPG.ef9bbabaa584c0f989681@news2.cts.com>,
Timothy B. Burleson <tbb@nospam.cts.com> wrote:
>
>If I'm elected president:
>
>No tax benefit for having children. Government should stay out of the 
>procreation business!

Good....

>I propose a system where tax deductions are allowed based solely on the 
>distance a person lives from the place they are employed.

So you're going to tax me when I get laid off, or find a better job?  Or are
you going to force me to sell my house and uproot myself every couple of
years?  Or force me to find a job within 5 miles of my house (hmmm, the
7/11 on the corner is hiring).

>Frankly, I'm surprised the citizens of this country have allowed our 
>highway system to exist in its current form for so long.

Frankly, I'm surprised such idiotic proposals exist.  Then again, this is
Usenet.

jim

-- 
"They were closed because I went there at a time they weren't open"
	--- A friend, explaining why she got home early Saturday

Jim Harkins                          jharkins@netcom.com 
San Diego, CA.