🚀 go-pugleaf

Like so many of us (I'm the owner of a RW8438E), you've found out the hard
way that Creative could care less about the owners of their products. I
guess they figure there are enough suckers born every minute to sustain
their sales, so repeat customers are not worth the effort.
My response is to advise anyone with whom I come in contact *not* to
purchase anything Creative sells and to explain why. If they are
incredulous, I refer them to the public forums where many dissatisfied
Creative customers state their cases. Over time, the weight of many negative
referrals will be felt (I hope).
Your Creative contact is basically saying "We've got your money, so piss
off.". We need to make *sure* as many potential buyers as possible are aware
of this corporate attitude *before* they spend their money.

"JP" <jamarno@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:9mg51t$qge$1@news.creativelabs.com...
> I've been trying to get a firmware upgrade for my RW8435E, but
> Creative Labs won't provide one, even though the real manufacturer,
> Samsung, has had one available for ten months now (version BS04).
>
> Phil Hemmert of Creative says that his company won't provide an
> upgrade and that one isn't needed because the product does
> everything advertised on the box.  But if a firmware upgrade
> wasn't needed, why did Samsung release one?  The BS04 upgrade
> reportedly fixes some problems with burning certain brands of
> disks and also adds some features.
>
>
>
>

Peter van der Goes wrote:

>Like so many of us (I'm the owner of a RW8438E), you've found out the hard
>way that Creative could care less about the owners of their products. I
>guess they figure there are enough suckers born every minute to sustain
>their sales, so repeat customers are not worth the effort.

Everybody should consider filing a complaint at 1-800-998-1000
and also with www.bbb.org and www.consumeraffairs.com .

Interstingly, I had my first run-in with Creative support this week. I had a
CDROM drive that would not get recognized by win98se. I could never get
through to the dial support so I filed an online request. The doofus who
answered it said I had a bad IDE cable. Fine I replaced it - no help. He
decalred my drive defective and said I should send it in on an RMA.

Before sending my drive off to oblivion I decided to spend some time doing
some deeper diagnostics. After a couple of hours of elimination (started by
buying an identical drive from a local store, plugging it in and getting
identical results) I narrowed it down to a BIOS setting. Changed that and
Voila! the drive works. Now if that moron would have spent a few more
minutes thinking about the problem he could have saved Creative a bunch of
bucks (had I sent the drive in for repair) and alot of frustration on my
part.

I updated my issue record and lambasted them for their poor performance.
And, for the record (I told them this too) I am a senior software architect
specializing in quality assurance, tech support (levels 1, 2 &3) and
customer satisfaction. After this experience I immediately return the Nomad
mp3 player I had just purchased.

Howard

"JP" <jamarno@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:9mg51t$qge$1@news.creativelabs.com...
> I've been trying to get a firmware upgrade for my RW8435E, but
> Creative Labs won't provide one, even though the real manufacturer,
> Samsung, has had one available for ten months now (version BS04).
>
> Phil Hemmert of Creative says that his company won't provide an
> upgrade and that one isn't needed because the product does
> everything advertised on the box.  But if a firmware upgrade
> wasn't needed, why did Samsung release one?  The BS04 upgrade
> reportedly fixes some problems with burning certain brands of
> disks and also adds some features.
>
>
>
>

You are fortunate to posess the skills and talent to solve these types of
problems for yourself. Think of all the poor folk who *depend* on vendor
tech support and get what you got from Creative!

"Howard Moskovitz" <blackwing@mediaone.net> wrote in message
news:9ml9a7$2a7$1@news.creativelabs.com...
> Interstingly, I had my first run-in with Creative support this week. I had
a
> CDROM drive that would not get recognized by win98se. I could never get
> through to the dial support so I filed an online request. The doofus who
> answered it said I had a bad IDE cable. Fine I replaced it - no help. He
> decalred my drive defective and said I should send it in on an RMA.
>
> Before sending my drive off to oblivion I decided to spend some time doing
> some deeper diagnostics. After a couple of hours of elimination (started
by
> buying an identical drive from a local store, plugging it in and getting
> identical results) I narrowed it down to a BIOS setting. Changed that and
> Voila! the drive works. Now if that moron would have spent a few more
> minutes thinking about the problem he could have saved Creative a bunch of
> bucks (had I sent the drive in for repair) and alot of frustration on my
> part.
>
> I updated my issue record and lambasted them for their poor performance.
> And, for the record (I told them this too) I am a senior software
architect
> specializing in quality assurance, tech support (levels 1, 2 &3) and
> customer satisfaction. After this experience I immediately return the
Nomad
> mp3 player I had just purchased.
>
> Howard
>
> "JP" <jamarno@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
> news:9mg51t$qge$1@news.creativelabs.com...
> > I've been trying to get a firmware upgrade for my RW8435E, but
> > Creative Labs won't provide one, even though the real manufacturer,
> > Samsung, has had one available for ten months now (version BS04).
> >
> > Phil Hemmert of Creative says that his company won't provide an
> > upgrade and that one isn't needed because the product does
> > everything advertised on the box.  But if a firmware upgrade
> > wasn't needed, why did Samsung release one?  The BS04 upgrade
> > reportedly fixes some problems with burning certain brands of
> > disks and also adds some features.
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

Here is the message I sent to Creative in response to my issue:

Response from Customer:   8/29/01 8:05:17 PM


OK. Since the level 1 support person who was handling
my issue seems to have stopped looking at this open
issue, and since he was so quick to write it off as a
bad drive that I would have to live without for 2-4
weeks while it was sent in for RMA repair, and since
he was non-responsive to my inquiries as to whether I
could get a replacement drive secured against a credit
card before shipping back the suspect drive, I decided
to take matters into my own hands (being a senior
architect in software QA and level 2/3
support/maintenance).

To verify his claims that I have a bad drive I had a
friend at a computer retail shop lend me a new drive
of the same model and plugged into my system. IT
BEHAVED IN THE VERY SAME MANNER AS THE SUSPECT DRIVE.
Hence the logical conclusion - my drive is not faulty.
Since I replaced the IDE cable that left the IDE
controller itself or sofwtare/firmware.

I swapped the drive with my primary drive and set it
to MASTER. The system refused to recognize the drive
at all. Since my other drive IS recognized readily as
the master in the same channel  I concluded that the
controller is OK.

Next - check firmware. I looked at my BIOS settings (I
recently updated my BIOS to the latest / greatest). I
discovered that the BIOS had plug & play turned off. I
enabled plug and play and disabled PCI IRQ steering in
Windows and VOILA! the drive is now recognized at all
times.

My questiona to the engineer who worked my case and to
Creative are as follows:

1. Why doesn't your level 1 staff know how to run
through the same basic tests?

2. Why isn't there a test procedure akin to what I did
in your knowledge base?

3. Why were my requests for someone to call me live
to run through some diagnostics ignored?

4. What excuse could you possibly have for my never
getting through to a live person on your dial-up
support helpdesk over the course of THREE calls during
which I was placed on hold for a total of well over an
hour (after20-30 minutes of hold time at long-distance
rates I usually give up in disgust)? If you want to
sling the "well we get so many calls" excuse then at
least make it a toll free line so I don't spend day
rate mega bucks to sit on hold and listen to Muzak.

In short, I have owned several Creative products and
they are usually good products that I have not needed
help from you tech support center. This incident,
however, has been a towering dissapointment and will
make me think twice about buying your products in the
future.

And, again, for the record - this is my opinion as a
senior quality assurance and tech support architect
with over 23 years experience.

"Peter van der Goes" <pvdg@oklahoma.net> wrote in message
news:9mgn7e$6b4$1@news.creativelabs.com...
> Like so many of us (I'm the owner of a RW8438E), you've found out the hard
> way that Creative could care less about the owners of their products. I
> guess they figure there are enough suckers born every minute to sustain
> their sales, so repeat customers are not worth the effort.
> My response is to advise anyone with whom I come in contact *not* to
> purchase anything Creative sells and to explain why. If they are
> incredulous, I refer them to the public forums where many dissatisfied
> Creative customers state their cases. Over time, the weight of many
negative
> referrals will be felt (I hope).
> Your Creative contact is basically saying "We've got your money, so piss
> off.". We need to make *sure* as many potential buyers as possible are
aware
> of this corporate attitude *before* they spend their money.
>
> "JP" <jamarno@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
> news:9mg51t$qge$1@news.creativelabs.com...
> > I've been trying to get a firmware upgrade for my RW8435E, but
> > Creative Labs won't provide one, even though the real manufacturer,
> > Samsung, has had one available for ten months now (version BS04).
> >
> > Phil Hemmert of Creative says that his company won't provide an
> > upgrade and that one isn't needed because the product does
> > everything advertised on the box.  But if a firmware upgrade
> > wasn't needed, why did Samsung release one?  The BS04 upgrade
> > reportedly fixes some problems with burning certain brands of
> > disks and also adds some features.
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

I am rather curious.
What is the make and model of your motherboard?

The email is not active.
"Howard Moskovitz" <blackwing@mediaone.net> wrote in message
news:9ml9a7$2a7$1@news.creativelabs.com...
> Interstingly, I had my first run-in with Creative support this week. I had
a
> CDROM drive that would not get recognized by win98se. I could never get
> through to the dial support so I filed an online request. The doofus who
> answered it said I had a bad IDE cable. Fine I replaced it - no help. He
> decalred my drive defective and said I should send it in on an RMA.
>
> Before sending my drive off to oblivion I decided to spend some time doing
> some deeper diagnostics. After a couple of hours of elimination (started
by
> buying an identical drive from a local store, plugging it in and getting
> identical results) I narrowed it down to a BIOS setting. Changed that and
> Voila! the drive works. Now if that moron would have spent a few more
> minutes thinking about the problem he could have saved Creative a bunch of
> bucks (had I sent the drive in for repair) and alot of frustration on my
> part.
>
> I updated my issue record and lambasted them for their poor performance.
> And, for the record (I told them this too) I am a senior software
architect
> specializing in quality assurance, tech support (levels 1, 2 &3) and
> customer satisfaction. After this experience I immediately return the
Nomad
> mp3 player I had just purchased.
>
> Howard
>
> "JP" <jamarno@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
> news:9mg51t$qge$1@news.creativelabs.com...
> > I've been trying to get a firmware upgrade for my RW8435E, but
> > Creative Labs won't provide one, even though the real manufacturer,
> > Samsung, has had one available for ten months now (version BS04).
> >
> > Phil Hemmert of Creative says that his company won't provide an
> > upgrade and that one isn't needed because the product does
> > everything advertised on the box.  But if a firmware upgrade
> > wasn't needed, why did Samsung release one?  The BS04 upgrade
> > reportedly fixes some problems with burning certain brands of
> > disks and also adds some features.
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

Welcome to the wonderful world of CL, where the tech support knows less
about the product than you do.  FWIW I had nearly the same experience.
It took me 3 weeks to convince the tech support that my drive was
defective (would seek for minutes) and they finally RMA'd it.
No problems with the new drive since.

Jason Stefanovich
Software Test Engineer

Howard Moskovitz wrote:
> 
> Interstingly, I had my first run-in with Creative support this week. I had a
> CDROM drive that would not get recognized by win98se. I could never get
> through to the dial support so I filed an online request. The doofus who
> answered it said I had a bad IDE cable. Fine I replaced it - no help. He
> decalred my drive defective and said I should send it in on an RMA.
> 
> Before sending my drive off to oblivion I decided to spend some time doing
> some deeper diagnostics. After a couple of hours of elimination (started by
> buying an identical drive from a local store, plugging it in and getting
> identical results) I narrowed it down to a BIOS setting. Changed that and
> Voila! the drive works. Now if that moron would have spent a few more
> minutes thinking about the problem he could have saved Creative a bunch of
> bucks (had I sent the drive in for repair) and alot of frustration on my
> part.
> 
> I updated my issue record and lambasted them for their poor performance.
> And, for the record (I told them this too) I am a senior software architect
> specializing in quality assurance, tech support (levels 1, 2 &3) and
> customer satisfaction. After this experience I immediately return the Nomad
> mp3 player I had just purchased.
> 
> Howard
> 
> "JP" <jamarno@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
> news:9mg51t$qge$1@news.creativelabs.com...
> > I've been trying to get a firmware upgrade for my RW8435E, but
> > Creative Labs won't provide one, even though the real manufacturer,
> > Samsung, has had one available for ten months now (version BS04).
> >
> > Phil Hemmert of Creative says that his company won't provide an
> > upgrade and that one isn't needed because the product does
> > everything advertised on the box.  But if a firmware upgrade
> > wasn't needed, why did Samsung release one?  The BS04 upgrade
> > reportedly fixes some problems with burning certain brands of
> > disks and also adds some features.
> >
> >
> >
> >