🚀 go-pugleaf

Marinos J. Yannikos wrote:
> 
> I wonder if it would make sense to attempt to write a game (multimedia?)
> programming library which supports DirectX as well as Linux/SVGAlib and
> perhaps X. It looks like all major companies have switched to DirectX,
> so if there was a way to support most useful DirectX functions under
> Linux, the growing Linux community might benefit from this. Note that
> there are 2 possibilities: 1) attempt to "port" DirectX to Linux/SVGAlib
> and 2) write a library with its own API which will work with DirectX and
> Linux/SVGAlib.
> 
> This is just an idea, not a real proposal. What do you think?
> (I wonder if the guys at ID software already have something like this)
> 
> -nino

I find it very intersting because I had exactly the same idea a few
months
ago ;-). As a Linux fan, I had begun to work on a new (private) project
called the "Linux Game SDK", which is more or less and equivalent of the
DirectX API, but specific to Linux/Un*x. I have written a little
presentation
of this project at the following URL:

	http://www.essi.fr/~speter/gsdk.html

Please note that serious development isn't yet, that's just a set of
ideas
I think we should try to implement as a team work worldwide :). I kept
this
project private until now as I expected to do a little more work on it
before
making a public announcement, but if some other Linux enthusiasts would
like
to contribute, then I'd like to hear your opinions!


-- 
-------------------------------------------------
           Stephane Peter - ESSI 1
  Ecole Superieure en Sciences Informatiques
      Universite de Nice Sophia-Antipolis
e-mail: Stephane.Peter@essi.fr  IRC: MEGASTeP
       Membre de l'ADE (ade@essi.fr)
	http://www.essi.fr/~speter/
-------------------------------------------------
linux linux linux linux linux linux linux linux

Peter Stephane (speter@essi.fr) wrote:
: I find it very intersting because I had exactly the same idea a few
: months
: ago ;-). As a Linux fan, I had begun to work on a new (private) project
: called the "Linux Game SDK", which is more or less and equivalent of the
: DirectX API, but specific to Linux/Un*x. I have written a little
: presentation
: of this project at the following URL:
: 
: 	http://www.essi.fr/~speter/gsdk.html
: 
: Please note that serious development isn't yet, that's just a set of
: ideas
: I think we should try to implement as a team work worldwide :). I kept
: this
: project private until now as I expected to do a little more work on it
: before
: making a public announcement, but if some other Linux enthusiasts would
: like
: to contribute, then I'd like to hear your opinions!

Sounds like a great idea.  Also, there is a project called GGI which 
incorporates graphics directly into the linux kernel...  It might be easier
to develop a game sdk for linux using GGI for the interface.  However I do
believe that GGI was only designed to work at the console, and not under X.
MOre information can be found at : 

	http://synergy.caltech.edu/~ggi

Anyways the information you provide on your web page sounds like it would
be a great project...

-- 
 _/_/_/_/  _/        _/_/_/_/   T Jones
   _/     _/            _/      tljones1@eos.ncsu.edu
  _/     _/        _/  _/       NCSU - Department of Computer Science
 _/     _/_/_/_/  _/_/_/        http://krusty.rh.ncsu.edu/~tavaris

>>>>> "T" == T Jones <tavaris@krusty.rh.ncsu.edu> writes:

> Sounds like a great idea.  Also, there is a project called GGI which
> incorporates graphics directly into the linux kernel...  It might be
> easier to develop a game sdk for linux using GGI for the interface.
> However I do believe that GGI was only designed to work at the
> console, and not under X.  MOre information can be found at :

> 	http://synergy.caltech.edu/~ggi

I can't help feeling there ought to be some connection with the Cygnus
project to make free headers for Win32, to go with ports of the gcc,
gdb, etc., toolchain, so that people can develop Win32 code using
freely available tools.  And, of course, with WINE.  What would be
really cool would be DirectX/Direct3D on Linux, using the Windoze
drivers provided by the card manufacturers.  Similarly for those
printers which require the host computer, GDI or whatever they're
called.
-- 
Bruce Stephens			| email: B.Stephens@math.ruu.nl
Utrecht University              | telephone: +31 30 2534630
Department of Mathematics       | telefax:   +31 30 2518394
P.O. Box 80010, 3508 TA Utrecht, The Netherlands

Peter Stephane (speter@essi.fr) wrote:
: Marinos J. Yannikos wrote:
: > 
: > I wonder if it would make sense to attempt to write a game (multimedia?)
: > programming library which supports DirectX as well as Linux/SVGAlib and
: > perhaps X. It looks like all major companies have switched to DirectX,
: > so if there was a way to support most useful DirectX functions under
: > Linux, the growing Linux community might benefit from this. Note that
: > there are 2 possibilities: 1) attempt to "port" DirectX to Linux/SVGAlib
: > and 2) write a library with its own API which will work with DirectX and
: > Linux/SVGAlib.

: 
: I find it very intersting because I had exactly the same idea a few
: months
: ago ;-). As a Linux fan, I had begun to work on a new (private) project
: called the "Linux Game SDK", which is more or less and equivalent of the
: DirectX API, but specific to Linux/Un*x.

I've been working a _binary_ compatible games library for Linux, dos
and Win32. It uses ELF format object files that are dynamically linked
at run time (it comes with an ELF linker/loader for Dos and Win32).
So far, I have it working on Linux/X11, Dos with VBE 1.2 and 2.0
and Win32 with DirectDraw. It is pretty cool, you only need one object
file for your game, all the OS dependent stuff is linked on at run time.

Could you guys (and anyone else interested in cross-developing Win32
and Dos software under Linux) check it out, and tell me what you think?

It's at: http://www.planet.net/pjoshv/cross-elf.html

Thanks!

-- 
Josh Vanderhoof (joshv@planet.net)

Peter Stephane (speter@essi.fr) wrote:
: I find it very intersting because I had exactly the same idea a few
: months
: ago ;-). As a Linux fan, I had begun to work on a new (private) project
: called the "Linux Game SDK", which is more or less and equivalent of the
: DirectX API, but specific to Linux/Un*x. I have written a little
: presentation
: of this project at the following URL:

Do you think perhaps it would be good to make a direct clone of the
DirectX API, to make porting easier?  Or would it be better to make a
new API?

Also, you seem to be lacking a general event-handler library, which I
think would be useful to pull together the other libraries (ie,
network events, mouse/keyboard events, timer events, etc., with a
common event interface).  I would think this would be easiest to
implement using threads.

Lastly, I wouldn't bother working on specific serial-port support,
since users can just setup SLIP or whatever, and treat it as a normal
TCP/IP connection.  (if you want, maybe you can write some simple
scripts to call dip or whatever though).

In any case, I'd love to contribute to this project.  I'm a strong C
coder with mediocre graphic skills, but I can learn fast :>

-- Dan 

Agthorr (agthorr@sputnik.res.wpi.edu) wrote:
: Do you think perhaps it would be good to make a direct clone of the
: DirectX API, to make porting easier?  Or would it be better to make a
: new API?

A Microsoft DirectX or Apple GameSprocket compatible library would have
one very big advantage over a new API. The former would make a linux port
extremely inexpensive and therefore more like to happen (at the commercial
game developer level, not the hobbyist level). 

Tony
-- 
------------------
Tony Tribelli
adtribelli@acm.org

Agthorr wrote:
> 
> Peter Stephane (speter@essi.fr) wrote:
> : I find it very intersting because I had exactly the same idea a few
> : months
> : ago ;-). As a Linux fan, I had begun to work on a new (private) project
> : called the "Linux Game SDK", which is more or less and equivalent of the
> : DirectX API, but specific to Linux/Un*x. I have written a little
> : presentation
> : of this project at the following URL:
> 
> Do you think perhaps it would be good to make a direct clone of the
> DirectX API, to make porting easier?  Or would it be better to make a
> new API?

I think we should write a new API specific to Linux, easier to use than 
the DirectX (Windoze) API which is not that easy to use... 

Once this will be accomplished, we can make a wrapper library on top
of this Linux API that is very similar to DirectX (which relies on the
COM object model and so is very specific to Windows!!) or another 
game-related API.

> Also, you seem to be lacking a general event-handler library, which I
> think would be useful to pull together the other libraries (ie,
> network events, mouse/keyboard events, timer events, etc., with a
> common event interface).  I would think this would be easiest to
> implement using threads.

Why not... We'll need some additionnal libraries that we'll just make
life more simple!

> Lastly, I wouldn't bother working on specific serial-port support,
> since users can just setup SLIP or whatever, and treat it as a normal
> TCP/IP connection.  (if you want, maybe you can write some simple
> scripts to call dip or whatever though).

The configuration of SLIP is rather difficult for a basic Linux user 
(especially if he has no modem), so I think it's a better thing to 
work also on serial port support, as it's not more difficult than 
TCP/IP (you write on the serial device instead of a socket).

> In any case, I'd love to contribute to this project.  I'm a strong C
> coder with mediocre graphic skills, but I can learn fast :>

We'll need also assembly coders, I've just tried out NASM, it's a great
assembler for the x86 processors, the syntax is very similar to the one
of TASM, and it works very well with ELF under Linux.

I can't work a lot on this project because of exams and other projects,
but
I'll set up a mailing list ASAP and then I'll post in c.o.l.a an
announce
for those of you that want to contribute of just chat ;)



-- 
-------------------------------------------------
           Stephane Peter - ESSI 1
  Ecole Superieure en Sciences Informatiques
      Universite de Nice Sophia-Antipolis
e-mail: Stephane.Peter@essi.fr  IRC: MEGASTeP
       Membre de l'ADE (ade@essi.fr)
	http://www.essi.fr/~speter/
-------------------------------------------------
linux linux linux linux linux linux linux linux

Peter Stephane (speter@essi.fr) wrote:
: Once this will be accomplished, we can make a wrapper library on top
: of this Linux API that is very similar to DirectX (which relies on the
: COM object model and so is very specific to Windows!!) or another 
: game-related API.
: 

COM is not specific to Windows.  The implementation of DX using COM
under Windows is specific to Windows.  I have COM compliant objects
that work just fine without Windows.

Paul

On 27 Jan 1997 18:04:42 GMT, Josh Vanderhoof <joshv@planet.net> wrote:

>I've been working a _binary_ compatible games library for Linux, dos
>and Win32. It uses ELF format object files that are dynamically linked
>at run time (it comes with an ELF linker/loader for Dos and Win32).
>So far, I have it working on Linux/X11, Dos with VBE 1.2 and 2.0
>and Win32 with DirectDraw. It is pretty cool, you only need one object
>file for your game, all the OS dependent stuff is linked on at run time.

Me too, but (sigh), my company owns the code not me, so I can't share it.
Because of the dynamic linking aspect, I will try to get the "drivers"
source released as a separate thing from the "main game", as I expect the
company only really cares about keeping the game parts secret.

wibble,
-- Jamie Lokier